P2P Lending / NFT Lending Forum

Per their announcement on the site today, the following is happening ~ Dec 10th:

We are standardizing data fields to be consistent across the Lending Club platform. As a result, some date and credit attribute fields that are not available in certain sections of the site, such as the filters on the Browse Note page, will be removed from other areas of the site.
 
Removed Date Fields:
accept_d
exp_d
list_d
 
Removed Credit Attribute Fields:
acc_now_delinq
acc_open_past_24mths
bc_open_to_buy
percent_bc_gt_75
bc_util
delinq_amnt
mths_since_recent_inq
mths_since_recent_revol_delinq
mths_since_recent_bc
mort_acc
total_bal_ex_mort
total_bc_limit
total_il_high_credit_limit
num_rev_accts
mths_since_recent_bc_dlq
pub_rec_bankruptcies
num_accts_ever_120_pd
chargeoff_within_12_mths
tax_liens
num_sats
num_tl_op_past_12m
mo_sin_rcnt_tl
tot_hi_cred_lim             
tot_cur_bal
avg_cur_bal
num_bc_tl
num_actv_bc_tl
num_bc_sats
pct_tl_nvr_dlq
num_tl_90g_dpd_24m
num_tl_30dpd
num_tl_120dpd_2m
num_il_tl
mo_sin_old_il_acct
num_actv_rev_tl
mo_sin_old_rev_tl_op
mo_sin_rcnt_rev_tl_op
total_rev_hi_lim
num_rev_tl_bal_gt_0
num_op_rev_tl               
tot_coll_amt

The war with the ecosystem continues.  This is absurd.

from: rawraw on November 06, 2014, 09:14:28 AM

Nice.  This should discourage some of those pesky 3rd parties.  Which I assume is the "real" goal.

I cannot say that I am all that upset.

Where, please? 
Looked all over--can't find it--please help?  It's probably right in front of my face somewhere.

Shouldn't this announcement have been accompanied by some good news about added things to come?

from: Ran on November 06, 2014, 09:15:39 AM

This is bloody disturbing, even though most fields they are removing are pretty useless there are a few which are quite important...

osper has much better and extensive data, as well as robust API, so from that perspective Prosper wins.

Main problem there is that 90% of loans go to whole side, so you only get 1-2 decent loans a day.

They have some minor weird API issues, but overall a much better system.

I get leveling the playing field with the browser-based investor.  But you already have this data and are providing it through the API.  Why not just increase the browser-based filter options?

from: jpildis on November 06, 2014, 09:07:02 AM

http://kb.lendingclub.com/siteupdates/articles/Site_Updates/Recent-and-upcoming-changes-to-the-downloadable-data-files-and-API-services/?l=en_US&fs=Search&pn=1

Thanks for the link, helpul. I thought they are getting rid of SOAP API altogether, why are they updating it?

Appreciate the link.  Thank you.

Because in the email notification LC sent on 10/16, it stated that the "legacy SOAP services will be supported through the end of this year".  So, with the credit data field update on ~ 12/10, the SOAP API still has about 3 weeks of life.

OK, that makes sense then, we have been focused on fully migrating to REST API, but makes sense that they have to support legacy systems till official kill date.

When I look at the bigger picture I consider this to be a reasonable thing for LC to do.

Can you explain how giving less data and choices to your customers even though the data is clearly available and useful a good thing to do in the long run?

One of the good things about the platforms has been their transparency and data sharing, if they take away half of the data sets there is now way that is good.

It may not be "good". But I think it's "reasonable".

This may be the best solution for keeping the playing field theoretically level. You can't reasonably expect them to undergo a large development effort on the website in order to offer 41 new ambiguously-useful and overwhelmingly-various filters for every investor. That plus any other number of complications-we-don't-know-about (e.g. time constraints) probably makes this move the best solution.

None of it need be permanent... they are quite able to piecemeal-add filters/fields for everyone equally as it is expedient to do so in the future.

LC has made keeping-it-fair moves that were to the advantage of small-investors-with-automation in the past, and I appreciate the continued effort regardless of whether it is a slight upon my practices.

from: TonySaunders on November 06, 2014, 01:38:09 PM

Quote"> from: jpildis on November 06, 2014, 09:07:02 AM

Now that I look at this list... I don't understand the motive for removing some of these. Regular users CAN see metrics like "Delinquent Amount". Why would they remove that from use by automation?

EDIT: Is there some part of the site that doesn't have this information available? Doesn't that seem like a pretty important and useful metric?

EDIT: Perhaps they will be adding new fields with the same data under a more consistent heading?

EDIT: Presumably, this means that they will be removing it from use by regular users as well. Otherwise it's a screen scraping game (again).

I think this entire thread may have jumped into hysterical speculation.

Read the message carefully. (Link below.) It definitely says that all the data will still be available via the "download all" CSV file on the "My Notes" page. It does NOT specifically say that the data will not be available via the REST API. It only says that some areas of the site are changing.

I find the information WAAAAY too ambiguous for us to be assuming that it's getting ripped out of the API. They are clearly still fine with us having the data because you can still download it. It says that some format changes will be made in the API, but not that the API will definitely be limited.

http://kb.lendingclub.com/siteupdates/articles/Site_Updates/Recent-and-upcoming-changes-to-the-downloadable-data-files-and-API-services/?l=en_US&fs=Search&pn=1

EDIT: If the data is available in our downloadable note data and not in the API.. then it's like they are okay with us knowing about current delinquencies only AFTER we buy a note but not before. So is it a game of buying them to find out which ones suck, and then selling the ones you don't like?

The way I read, it does say that the data files will be modified:

Quote

Agree with you. Leveling the field is just an excuse to reduce the amount of information available to lenders to make smart decisions. From credit modeling, note selection, and determining overall borrower quality on marketplace lending platform perspective, it is not a good move to reduce the number of available loan and borrower attributes.

Lending Club is removing almost half of the available loan attributes. This is going to benefit Prosper as they provide 500+ loan attributes for their listings compared to less than 100 that LC was providing.

from: GS on November 06, 2014, 04:25:54 PM

I hadn't bothered to open a Prosper account until now. LC just can't be trusted. The data has always been poor with lots of errors and inconsistencies. They decided to fix things;"Hey, I got an idea! Why don't we just remove all the data? That will stop their bitching."

Has anyone emailed LC to get their response about this?  If not, I will tomorrow

from: hoggy1 on November 06, 2014, 05:19:38 PM

You won't even be able top tell if a borrower has current delinquencies. Astonishing!

This is nuts.

from: TonySaunders on November 06, 2014, 07:33:25 PM

Quote"> from: hoggy1 on November 06, 2014, 05:19:38 PM

I think the fat lady has left the building.   

from: core on November 06, 2014, 09:25:17 PM

Situation is worse than LC's announcement.

Tonite I downloaded the three big historical loan data files, and all these fields are GONE NOW.  Not December 10th.  Now. 

File previously had 100 fields.  Now has 56.

from: Fred93 on November 07, 2014, 03:22:18 AM

from: core on November 06, 2014, 09:25:17 PM

Yes Dan all businesses exist to make money and LendingClub is no different.  You are preaching to the choir.  They just need to be more honest about it so these types of "misunderstandings" don't continue to happen in the future, with investors threatening (hah!) to go elsewhere with their frownie faces.  Like LendingClub is supposed to care in the least.

Certainly, if I was the CEO of LC I'd start preventing retail investors from investing in new notes pronto... soon after the IPO.  Gentle encouragement would be a good start.  Remove access to data, ban the script kiddies, make the site as hard to use as possible, etc.  (Gee, I think they got a head start on these.)  Only later would it become necessary to forcefully block new investments.  Problem is there's still notes on the platform for 5 years.  To fix that, I'd start to have little "system errors" from time to time where I take 1% of the notes off the table.  Rinse and repeat.  Eventually all the undesireables are gone.  If I play my cards right I could even keep a nontrivial amount of those investors' balances in the form of 18% fees and other creative fees.  Sounds like they're getting a head start on that too.

from: DanB on November 07, 2014, 05:46:20 AM

Quote"> from: rawraw on November 06, 2014, 01:51:49 PM

While the 41 fields may have been removed from the downloadable files, they are still in the REST API content for now, at least as of the 9 PM feeding last night.

Just an FYI... Other than the date fields, these were all fields that have been added fairly recently.  My filtering was on fields available from the original XML dataset.  As such, I won't lose anything here that I was ever really relying on.  I was capturing some of this info though, for future filtering considerations.  Sad to see it go. 

Another bad sign for Lending Club.  Very easy solution that wouldn't have hurt other tools: add functionality to the browser instead of taking it away from two other parts of site (API and download)

Posted on the main site but will probably get more interesting responses here:

As I've mentioned in another context, most 3rd party sites--which make up the so-called "ecosystem"--are just derivatives on something LC created. As an average non-accredited retail investor, I view the ecosystem as mostly adding a layer of fees to provide services of questionable value (speed, extra filtering, etc) that in some cases attempts to advantage certain investors at the expense of the rest. My bet is that the vast majority will fail to outperform a simple filter or investment approach, which has been shown again and again in all types of markets.

I know this opinion will annoy many users, especially the active crowd on this site or those who profit from LC's product, but personally I'm not sure why LC owes derivative businesses anything. I'm for any move that helps LC ensure a level playing field for retail investors, and as Peter said this change mostly impacts very large investors (and those that service them). Is the negativity here really about transparency? Or is it just about money and the fear that a derivative player won't be able to grab a slice of the pie?

No offense intended and just one guy's opinion!

I reported the following bug to LC soon after they added the traded notes file download

Quote

I'm psyched. Those fields were stupid anyway.

from: hippo387 on November 08, 2014, 06:57:54 AM

Quote"> from: turing on November 10, 2014, 10:15:09 AM

Personally, I'm just about fed up.  Lending Club won't even let us "slice and dice" (turing) our own portfolios on their own website. 
Nor will they make it easy to see how much money was invested in a portfolio, where it went (notes sold?), how much is left, and where it is now (sort and access by status). 

No improvement in that problem over several years is nearly enough for me, without losing a couple of favorite data points (which I've been having to track down on third party sites), not being able to find notes I want, etc.  Meanwhile, my "cash drag" has grown to 11% and I might put it back where it came from.

Quote

from: GS on November 10, 2014, 03:54:38 PM

Yeah, that is true, but on Interest Radar, there are usually a few that pass my filters left on there.  Enough to keep me fully invested, anyway.  But I were putting in new money, it would take a long time to get fully invested at that pace. 

from: Lovinglifestyle on November 10, 2014, 04:43:07 PM

I too just found some at 3:00 (2:00).  Couldn't believe there were 8 in my LC filter!  I picked 4 Es of the 8 total efg mix.  That was nice!

Quote"> from: jpildis on November 06, 2014, 09:07:02 AM