00:07.620 --> 00:09.450 Sean Murray: Hello everybody, it's Sean Murray here from 00:09.480 --> 00:12.720 deBanked TV. And we are live at the Southeast Acquirers show 00:12.840 --> 00:15.900 down in Bonita Springs, Florida. I'm here with Johny Fernandez. 00:16.020 --> 00:18.510 Johny Fernandez: And welcome you guys. And obviously we are very 00:18.510 --> 00:22.080 excited to be here, Sean, the weather has been great so far. I 00:22.080 --> 00:24.690 mean, we've been talking compared to New York, very 00:24.690 --> 00:27.840 similar points, sunshine, palm trees all around and just 00:27.900 --> 00:30.720 exciting to see the amount of people that are here at the 20th 00:30.900 --> 00:36.090 annual SEAA 2021 Conference. So Sean, so far, let's talk about 00:36.090 --> 00:38.100 what we've been seeing since we've been here. Since you've 00:38.100 --> 00:40.020 been to the state, kind of walk us through that. 00:40.050 --> 00:42.420 Sean Murray: Yeah, there's a lot of people here. Yeah. Yeah. I'm 00:42.420 --> 00:44.910 hearing that there's over 900 people here today. So the 00:44.910 --> 00:48.720 conference circuit is back it's going big payments is here, 00:48.720 --> 00:51.720 payments is back. And we're having a great time, there's a 00:51.720 --> 00:54.720 big exhibit hall behind us. There's a lot of people and all 00:54.720 --> 00:56.790 of you can see in the camera angle, but we have a lot of 00:56.790 --> 01:01.140 people mingling and networking. We have special badges that 01:01.140 --> 01:03.540 we'll be wearing that we're wearing now that we'll we'll 01:03.540 --> 01:05.100 hear more about. We'll hear more about. Yeah, we'll hear more 01:05.100 --> 01:05.460 about. 01:05.489 --> 01:07.049 Johny Fernandez: But Sean first, let's talk about your shirt. 01:07.080 --> 01:07.500 Sean Murray: Okay. 01:08.370 --> 01:11.160 Johny Fernandez: Talk to me. So, what's this guy's name Toucan 01:11.160 --> 01:11.730 Sam? 01:12.090 --> 01:13.440 Sean Murray: That would be Toucan Sean. 01:13.470 --> 01:13.770 Johny Fernandez: Sean. 01:13.830 --> 01:14.160 Sean Murray: Yeah. 01:14.190 --> 01:15.480 Johny Fernandez: So he's gonna be with us throughout the rest 01:15.480 --> 01:15.870 of the night. 01:15.870 --> 01:16.170 Sean Murray: Yeah. 01:16.350 --> 01:18.630 Johny Fernandez: Awesome. I like the color too, it brings out. I 01:18.630 --> 01:21.270 feel like we went for a very Florida vibe. That was what 01:21.270 --> 01:21.990 we're going for. 01:22.050 --> 01:23.040 Sean Murray: Is that Florida? 01:23.040 --> 01:24.960 Johny Fernandez: That is kind Florida, that's like business 01:24.960 --> 01:28.050 casual in Florida. You're more like, hey, I'm here. I'm here to 01:28.050 --> 01:30.960 make a comeback. Just like the event space that we're at today. 01:30.990 --> 01:32.850 Sean Murray: Yeah, I got to come up with like a saying like, 01:32.880 --> 01:33.990 follow your nose. 01:33.990 --> 01:37.260 Johny Fernandez: Follow your nose, that'd be good. Or maybe 01:37.260 --> 01:41.640 something like, follow the Sam, Toucan Sam or follow the Sean. 01:41.640 --> 01:44.580 Sean Murray: Follow the Sean. Okay, alright I'm kind of 01:44.580 --> 01:44.850 feeling it. 01:44.850 --> 01:46.290 Johny Fernandez: Well we'll work on it throughout the rest of the 01:46.290 --> 01:46.530 night. 01:46.560 --> 01:46.980 Sean Murray: Okay. 01:47.100 --> 01:49.170 Johny Fernandez: Well, you know what, now let's bring in one of 01:49.170 --> 01:51.930 the Board of Directors of the event, he can kind of walk us 01:51.930 --> 01:54.600 through a little bit more about what's going on and what people 01:54.600 --> 01:57.870 can expect. Here at the event. Derek Vowel, we want to welcome 01:57.870 --> 01:58.080 you. 01:58.080 --> 01:59.310 Derek Vowel: Hi, we're so glad to have you guys. 01:59.310 --> 02:00.900 Johny Fernandez: Likewise, Thank you for being here. 02:01.200 --> 02:02.490 Derek Vowel: That's Tou Sean now. 02:02.610 --> 02:07.530 Johny Fernandez: Tou, Tou Sean. I like that, that's great. 02:07.650 --> 02:09.060 Sean Murray: Well, you had plenty of time to think about 02:09.060 --> 02:09.240 it. 02:10.229 --> 02:11.219 Derek Vowel: Well don't, hey. 02:14.640 --> 02:16.710 Sean Murray: So Derek, let's go ahead and talk a little bit 02:16.710 --> 02:19.770 about the event. So walk us through how many people are 02:19.770 --> 02:20.280 here. 02:21.300 --> 02:24.450 Derek Vowel: The last time I checked registration, we had 924 02:24.450 --> 02:28.260 people. And we usually have about 100 walk ins day of so 02:28.290 --> 02:31.440 we're clearly going to surpass the minimum. Back when we 02:31.440 --> 02:34.680 started planning the show two years ago, we're filing here. 02:34.950 --> 02:37.440 And during all the COVID stuff, I thought we'd get like 400 02:37.440 --> 02:40.890 people that was gonna be the high watermark. But here we are. 02:40.920 --> 02:43.200 There's everybody but Jesus apparently at my show. 02:43.800 --> 02:46.050 Johny Fernandez: So kind of walk us through obviously, some 02:46.050 --> 02:48.870 people, you know, are trying to be a little bit more aware of 02:48.870 --> 02:51.900 like social distance. Yes. And obviously with the whole COVID 02:51.900 --> 02:55.320 factor. So walk us through the stickers. Okay. And what exactly 02:55.350 --> 02:57.570 it is. So, obviously. 02:58.230 --> 03:00.000 Derek Vowel: That is don't get near me, please. 03:00.060 --> 03:02.550 Johny Fernandez: So if people see this on their shirt. 03:02.550 --> 03:04.710 Derek Vowel: Just smile and wave at them, you know, they're not 03:04.710 --> 03:06.900 interested in participating in your conversation. They're here 03:06.900 --> 03:07.950 for education only. 03:08.070 --> 03:09.720 Johny Fernandez: So let's walk through the yellow one. 03:10.140 --> 03:12.450 Derek Vowel: At here you're like. I like you, but not that 03:12.450 --> 03:14.820 much you're going to know about. That's literally why we called 03:14.820 --> 03:15.210 them off. 03:15.270 --> 03:18.480 Johny Fernandez: Alright. And so let's go ahead and talk about. 03:18.900 --> 03:21.480 Derek Vowel: These are for our wild and crazy people. They're 03:21.480 --> 03:22.350 here to have fun. 03:22.350 --> 03:24.390 Sean Murray: That's me why I'm here to have fun. Yeah. 03:25.230 --> 03:27.330 Johny Fernandez: I'm gonna go ahead and that will be me today. 03:27.390 --> 03:27.750 Sean Murray: Okay. 03:27.780 --> 03:30.630 Derek Vowel: I'm gonna be purple angry. I'm like, I'm here. I'm 03:30.630 --> 03:31.050 ready. 03:31.050 --> 03:32.760 Johny Fernandez: So let's talk about the purple. 03:32.790 --> 03:35.460 Derek Vowel: I'm a vaccinated person. So I'm good to go. No 03:35.460 --> 03:39.360 mask, we've put the exhibit hall tables spaced out about three 03:39.360 --> 03:42.570 feet apart, like to give it enough space. And we're not 03:42.600 --> 03:44.790 normally when you go to the exhibit hall, you just walk 03:44.790 --> 03:47.970 around where you want, we're going to open the doors, you can 03:47.970 --> 03:51.360 go this way, for one day, the next day, you come in the 03:51.360 --> 03:53.700 opposite way. And I like it because it means all of our 03:53.700 --> 03:56.610 exhibitors are gonna get intensely touched instead of 03:56.610 --> 03:58.980 people not making it to the corner to the middle. Because 03:58.980 --> 04:01.830 once you get in the line, you can't go back. Yeah. So I think 04:01.830 --> 04:02.760 it's good for everybody. 04:02.790 --> 04:04.980 Sean Murray: So let's talk a little bit about like the setup 04:04.980 --> 04:08.220 and how comfortable you guys had made other people feel about 04:08.220 --> 04:10.530 coming to the event. Because obviously, we've talked about it 04:10.530 --> 04:12.270 and there's 900 plus people here. 04:12.300 --> 04:16.710 Derek Vowel: Yes, we've tried to communicate space, do everything 04:16.710 --> 04:19.710 we can so that everybody's happy and comfortable. And a lot of 04:19.710 --> 04:21.960 people are still wearing masks, and that's just fine. It's like 04:21.990 --> 04:25.260 it's your comfort level. It's like this is your show, we want 04:25.260 --> 04:27.810 you to have a good time, we don't want no one to not enjoy 04:28.230 --> 04:29.130 their days here. 04:29.820 --> 04:31.500 Sean Murray: What What can you tell me about payments? What's 04:31.500 --> 04:32.730 happening in payments right now? 04:33.870 --> 04:36.930 Derek Vowel: It's a changing game every minute. Fintech you, 04:36.960 --> 04:40.050 nothing's boring. Like, I've been in this for half my life. 04:40.050 --> 04:41.670 So I guess 24 years. 04:42.210 --> 04:43.950 Johny Fernandez: But you're like 10 though, like. 04:44.490 --> 04:45.900 Derek Vowel: I literally was told by somebody that hadn't 04:45.900 --> 04:47.580 seen me in a while and they're like, you look like a little 04:47.580 --> 04:49.950 boy. And I'm like, that's the highest compliment I've had in 04:49.950 --> 04:54.840 years. So fintech changes on the daily. There's new products, 04:54.900 --> 04:58.410 like I work for Aliaswire, and we're that we're a hammer pad. 04:58.410 --> 05:01.740 We're a Cartesian company that works with commercial settlement 05:01.920 --> 05:04.620 to make money off of it. So it's just funny. It's like, patented 05:04.620 --> 05:07.110 that no one can do it, it's so much fun. It's like every day 05:07.110 --> 05:10.380 you learn something new. That's what's kept me in it. It's 05:10.380 --> 05:11.880 exciting. Not boring. 05:11.970 --> 05:13.590 Johny Fernandez: What changes have you guys seen having to 05:13.590 --> 05:16.470 make this event and moving forward? Like, I guess what will 05:16.470 --> 05:18.870 you guys be doing now? Because it's a changing game. 05:18.960 --> 05:22.110 Derek Vowel: Yeah, we've had, we've made changes virtually 05:22.110 --> 05:26.070 daily for six months. Like the hotels like a, can't be doing 05:26.070 --> 05:29.490 that, you can now you can do that. So it's been perplex 05:29.520 --> 05:32.520 perplexing and puzzling and trying to pull this off. And to 05:32.520 --> 05:36.030 be honored. Y'all wanted to be here, we have 1000 people, this 05:36.030 --> 05:38.580 is nuts. It's exciting. 05:39.270 --> 05:41.880 Sean Murray: I mean, I think the exhibit hall is a testament to 05:42.150 --> 05:45.360 the the desire for people to get back and networking again, like 05:45.360 --> 05:47.790 I just walked over there before, and it was like, it was like 05:47.790 --> 05:48.870 2019 all over again. 05:48.870 --> 05:49.860 Derek Vowel: Right. It's crazy. 05:49.890 --> 05:50.280 Sean Murray: Yeah. 05:51.090 --> 05:53.130 Derek Vowel: I mean, I had a year ago, I didn't think I'd be 05:53.130 --> 05:56.400 at the show without a mask on. Here I am, I can smile again. 05:57.270 --> 05:59.730 Sean Murray: So what can people expect when they come here? 05:59.940 --> 06:02.910 Besides the restrictions and the changes, but overall about the 06:02.910 --> 06:05.040 experience here? What what can they expect from that? 06:05.460 --> 06:07.680 Derek Vowel: I think everyone's gonna walk away with a smile on 06:07.680 --> 06:10.500 their face. We had good educational tracks, so it's 06:10.500 --> 06:13.380 like, there's something for everybody. I think it's gonna be 06:13.380 --> 06:15.990 a great show. Then next year, we're gonna be at the Loews 06:15.990 --> 06:19.980 Midtown Atlanta. And that was our prior record of 1000. We're 06:19.980 --> 06:22.380 going back, we're at a big one. So that'll be next year. 06:22.650 --> 06:24.960 Sean Murray: So and how many exhibitors are actually here? 06:24.990 --> 06:27.570 Derek Vowel: We had to shrink it this year. So there's only 90, 06:27.570 --> 06:30.930 we usually have about 105. But to get some of the food in not 06:30.930 --> 06:34.770 all of it, we just sort of had to make so many changes. So 06:34.770 --> 06:37.800 that's we got 90, we had a hard cap, there's no room with the 06:37.800 --> 06:40.860 social distancing. And you'll notice like a 10 of the tray 06:40.860 --> 06:43.590 pass where you'd normally deal with, we have food stations, 06:43.590 --> 06:47.130 because still can't be doing that you have to go up and get 06:47.130 --> 06:50.310 served. So it's still still restrictions to make people safe 06:50.310 --> 06:50.970 and comfortable. 06:51.570 --> 06:53.310 Sean Murray: Do you feel like there were any technological 06:53.310 --> 06:55.980 changes that took place in payments because of COVID, that 06:56.070 --> 06:58.350 might have otherwise not have occurred or occurred quicker? 06:58.740 --> 07:01.350 Derek Vowel: I think everybody's everyone's been wanting to do 07:01.350 --> 07:03.720 contactless for years and no one's really doing it. Now you 07:03.720 --> 07:07.260 have to cause COVID. So, that's the big thing that and the NFT 07:07.260 --> 07:10.440 stuff, they've been pushing that for six years. I didn't think we 07:10.440 --> 07:13.530 were ever gonna do it. Now. It's what everybody has to do so. 07:14.070 --> 07:15.990 It'll change tomorrow, if you ask me. Probably. 07:17.340 --> 07:19.770 Sean Murray: Awesome. Awesome. And last question, the big 07:19.770 --> 07:23.550 takeaway about this event, and also moving forward and what 07:23.550 --> 07:26.760 people can expect later on. In future shows. 07:26.760 --> 07:28.830 Derek Vowel: You never know what we're gonna do. I'm like, 07:29.130 --> 07:31.110 everyone thinks thir the best we like to think we're best in 07:31.110 --> 07:35.880 class, we don't go to boring resorts. We never had bad food. 07:35.910 --> 07:39.780 Like, this is an experience. Like I'm a salesperson, I should 07:39.780 --> 07:42.660 be selling. I'm not selling. I'm here to have a good show, are 07:42.660 --> 07:45.150 you liking it. So yeah, this is great. You can do everything. 07:45.540 --> 07:48.090 And I'm here in shorts. Best day ever. 07:48.630 --> 07:50.250 Johny Fernandez: Nice, well, Derek, thanks so much for 07:50.250 --> 07:51.060 joining us. 07:51.060 --> 07:52.530 Derek Vowel: If you need anything like you'll see me 07:52.530 --> 07:53.010 around. 07:53.160 --> 07:53.940 Sean Murray: Okay. Thanks again. 07:53.940 --> 07:54.210 Derek Vowel: Thank you. 07:54.210 --> 07:54.840 Sean Murray: Appreciate it. 07:55.230 --> 07:57.150 Johny Fernandez: That was great. And that was so interesting to 07:57.150 --> 08:02.520 really hear about how people still want to be in with other 08:02.520 --> 08:05.400 people and network with other people versus being locked up. 08:05.400 --> 08:07.890 Because that's what we've been seeing and people want to come 08:07.890 --> 08:09.990 back. Yeah. So go ahead. 08:10.020 --> 08:11.760 Sean Murray: I was just gonna say that, you know, here we were 08:11.760 --> 08:14.400 talking about, like, 900 people. Yeah. I didn't realize that 08:14.400 --> 08:17.550 there were walkins, too. Yeah. And that the number as he said 08:17.550 --> 08:21.420 iss actually over 1000. When you count them all up. I think 08:21.420 --> 08:25.410 that's an incredible number to be to have already in the month 08:25.410 --> 08:28.320 of May, right? Yeah. Because certain states like New York, we 08:28.320 --> 08:31.260 just got to the point where you can take your mask off, outside. 08:31.290 --> 08:34.140 Yeah. Now we have 1000 people indoors, some, some of them are 08:34.140 --> 08:37.230 wearing masks. But we have 1000 people indoors at a show 08:37.260 --> 08:41.520 networking literally behind us. It feels like 2019. 08:41.549 --> 08:43.499 Johny Fernandez: It does. And like you said, it's a comeback. 08:43.529 --> 08:46.439 It's a big comeback. And I think that's what everyone was worried 08:46.439 --> 08:50.789 about was was there going to be an event like this ever? Yeah. 08:50.789 --> 08:54.149 And clearly, we're seeing that it is going to happen, and it is 08:54.179 --> 08:57.659 happening now. And that we don't have to wait till you know, 08:57.659 --> 09:00.179 everything is over. Because people are willing to come out. 09:00.179 --> 09:03.569 And I think having things like the stickers, very smart idea. 09:03.659 --> 09:06.299 You know, now when you speak with someone, all right, this 09:06.299 --> 09:09.719 person is, you know, doesn't want to associate doesn't want 09:09.719 --> 09:12.179 to talk. Yeah. Or they do want to talk and they're willing to 09:12.179 --> 09:15.089 network. Yeah. And just when we go to the exhibit hall, and 09:15.089 --> 09:18.089 we'll be showing that a little bit later on between today and 09:18.089 --> 09:22.889 tomorrow, that there are you know, more than 90 booths set 09:22.889 --> 09:26.669 up, ready to network and ready to communicate with other people 09:26.669 --> 09:29.969 in the industry and the payments industry and seeing obviously 09:29.969 --> 09:32.699 how much that has changed throughout the last couple of 09:33.149 --> 09:35.879 months and last year. Yeah. So. 09:36.300 --> 09:38.400 Sean Murray: People said that everything was going to be 09:38.400 --> 09:42.240 remote afterwards. You had to do events online. It was all going 09:42.240 --> 09:44.520 to be Zoom forever. I was never a believer in it. I think you 09:44.520 --> 09:48.180 and I actually did like a Zoom call with each other. Like 09:48.180 --> 09:49.800 literally a year ago. Yeah. I think it might have been like 09:49.800 --> 09:52.230 May of last year. Oh yeah, yes. Well, literally like a year ago. 09:52.230 --> 09:56.400 A year ago, yeah. And I think we realized even then that there 09:56.400 --> 09:59.070 was gonna be a return to in person networking. Yeah. You 09:59.070 --> 10:02.460 know, this is just proof positive of it, people want to 10:02.460 --> 10:04.170 do this in person, there were there was a lot of things were 10:04.170 --> 10:06.510 like this will never be the same, you know, this has changed 10:06.510 --> 10:08.730 forever. That's just not the case, I think know, a lot of 10:08.730 --> 10:12.270 technology has come in and been added to the industry that 10:12.270 --> 10:15.030 otherwise wouldn't have been or have been faster. Because of 10:15.030 --> 10:17.670 COVID. Yeah. But when it comes to general networking events, 10:18.720 --> 10:21.600 online is just never going to replace, the in person 10:21.630 --> 10:22.230 altogether. 10:22.260 --> 10:24.390 Johny Fernandez: And it's like the experience, overall, the 10:24.390 --> 10:28.470 experience factor from something as simply as simple as walking 10:28.470 --> 10:33.360 into a hotel, and just feeling the energy that when you walk 10:33.360 --> 10:36.300 in, you're like, alright, like, these are people like me, you 10:36.300 --> 10:38.790 know, we're in the same industry, and we're really here 10:38.790 --> 10:42.540 to network and to meet people. But then there's also just like, 10:42.570 --> 10:46.140 meeting the educational aspect of it. But also, you know, just 10:46.170 --> 10:49.260 seeing the booth and, and just talking to someone that maybe 10:49.260 --> 10:52.800 you don't know, and having a cocktail and having some food 10:52.800 --> 10:56.070 and like that is ever gonna get old. And we've always talked 10:56.070 --> 10:59.700 about it, and the fact that this has been going on for 20 plus 20 10:59.730 --> 11:03.900 years. Yeah. Says things that speaks volumes, because at the 11:03.900 --> 11:06.450 end of the day, people are going to want to still do this and be 11:06.450 --> 11:10.050 here. And it's exciting to see that more than 900 people are 11:10.140 --> 11:13.200 already here. And it's just the first, it's not even the opening 11:13.200 --> 11:14.580 ceremony, hasn't even started yet. 11:14.610 --> 11:16.380 Sean Murray: Yeah, you know, and we're talking about events in 11:16.380 --> 11:18.930 general. But I think an important thing to mention is 11:18.930 --> 11:22.560 that we're at a payment show. And at deBanked, we often talk 11:22.560 --> 11:24.720 about small business finance, alternative lending, and so 11:24.720 --> 11:27.450 forth. And when we talk about payments, we end up talking 11:27.450 --> 11:30.660 about companies like Square, PayPal, we talk about the tech 11:30.660 --> 11:33.390 companies, because they have a lending component to them. And 11:33.390 --> 11:37.560 it could look like to an outsider that that's older as in 11:37.560 --> 11:40.380 payment, yet it has eradicated the rest of the payments 11:40.380 --> 11:42.330 industry. You know, that's crazy. That's not the case at 11:42.330 --> 11:45.150 all. Yeah. It's not that we're misrepresenting how it works. 11:45.180 --> 11:48.330 It's more just of, that's the angle that we often report from. 11:48.330 --> 11:50.610 Yep. But if you look around us, all these people are from the 11:50.610 --> 11:52.740 payments industry. Well, that although we have seen some 11:52.740 --> 11:55.050 people from the small business finance space here too, we 11:55.050 --> 11:58.590 bumped into. People are like Sean, Johny, we're like, hey, 11:58.590 --> 12:01.530 what's going on? Yeah, but payments is a very, very big 12:01.530 --> 12:05.580 industry, multi billion, if not multi trillion dollar industry. 12:05.910 --> 12:08.370 And it's a lot bigger than just you know, Square, Pay Pal,and 12:08.700 --> 12:11.340 all the rest. And so that's one of the one of the good things 12:11.340 --> 12:13.560 about being at a show like this is seeing what else is out 12:13.560 --> 12:17.280 there, and what everyone else is doing. And, you know, at the 12:17.280 --> 12:20.850 exhibit hall, back here, if you look around you just you just 12:20.850 --> 12:22.350 see that there's so much else going on. 12:22.380 --> 12:24.570 Johny Fernandez: There really is. And on top of that, I think 12:24.630 --> 12:29.730 something to really kind of make this experience even better is 12:29.730 --> 12:34.440 that the the weather is great. And just overall, it feels 12:34.440 --> 12:37.290 normal, it feels normal, it feels like normal times again, 12:37.800 --> 12:40.890 even though we technically aren't. Yeah. Still like, 12:40.890 --> 12:43.920 completely free. Yeah. But yeah, it feels like it's normal time. 12:43.920 --> 12:47.280 And I think, you know, they're going to be having from five to 12:47.280 --> 12:50.850 630, the opening reception here. And then from seven to 10, 12:50.850 --> 12:53.760 there's going to be an after hours party. So people are going 12:53.760 --> 12:56.520 to be able to network and pretty much talk to each other, maybe 12:56.520 --> 12:59.220 they haven't seen each other in a year, a year and a half. So 12:59.220 --> 13:01.230 that's gonna be a good experience for people here. And 13:01.230 --> 13:04.920 then tomorrow, it's going to be a couple of events going on from 13:05.100 --> 13:08.490 nine to 10, the exhibit hall is going to be opening up and then 13:08.490 --> 13:13.350 from 10 to about 12 is going to be some opening remarks, there's 13:13.350 --> 13:17.460 going to be some breakout sessions from 130, to about 230. 13:17.610 --> 13:20.310 Then again, another breakout session from 230 to three 13:20.310 --> 13:24.660 o'clock until like five so a lot of different breakout sessions, 13:24.660 --> 13:27.270 you know, educational aspects of it. Yeah. And then also just 13:27.270 --> 13:30.390 networking, because that's a lot of the big key aspects of why 13:30.390 --> 13:34.440 people are here, and you can see it keeps getting busier and 13:34.500 --> 13:36.960 people are still aren't arriving right now. So. 13:36.960 --> 13:39.690 Sean Murray: And bear in mind, this isn't even the exhibit hall 13:39.690 --> 13:40.080 that's behind us. 13:40.080 --> 13:40.890 Johny Fernandez: No, it's not this is just. 13:40.890 --> 13:42.360 Sean Murray: The exhibit hall is so packed that people are 13:42.360 --> 13:45.450 actually overflowing out into here. That's how crazy it is. 13:45.480 --> 13:48.180 Johny Fernandez: And it's, it's exciting to see and it's gonna 13:48.180 --> 13:50.850 be really exciting also to see tomorrow how everything kind of 13:50.850 --> 13:54.330 plays out. Yeah. And just like the different components of this 13:54.360 --> 13:58.800 event, so I'm definitely excited for it. Sean, go ahead. 13:58.860 --> 14:01.020 Sean Murray: I was just gonna say earlier, right before we 14:01.020 --> 14:03.900 went on the air, someone asked, or someone commented that it was 14:03.900 --> 14:06.540 good to see deBanked at a payment show. Yeah. As if that 14:06.540 --> 14:09.360 was totally unique. And although I did mention, before that we 14:09.360 --> 14:11.940 spent a lot of time talking about the tech side of payments, 14:12.270 --> 14:15.090 I think it's important to also mention the fact that deBanked 14:15.090 --> 14:18.480 started in the payments industry. Yeah. A long time ago 14:18.510 --> 14:21.450 deBanked was called merchant processing resource. 14:21.630 --> 14:22.890 Johny Fernandez: Almost 10 years like a little bit. 14:23.430 --> 14:26.370 Sean Murray: Yeah like, like 10, 10, 11, 10, 11 years ago. Yeah. 14:26.490 --> 14:29.190 And you know, it had a very long name merchant processing 14:29.190 --> 14:32.340 resource, right. And it's kind of sounded kind of generic, and 14:32.340 --> 14:34.710 it had .com at the end, and people would type in the wrong 14:34.710 --> 14:37.110 thing. So it wasn't branded very well. Yeah. And it was very 14:37.110 --> 14:39.930 payments focused. Yeah. And the reason that was is that a lot of 14:39.930 --> 14:43.770 the alternative lending industry that we talked about now, it was 14:43.770 --> 14:47.100 born out of payments. Yeah. So all of the all of the funding 14:47.100 --> 14:50.700 that people do now, it wouldn't have been made possible if some 14:50.700 --> 14:53.700 payment processors didn't come up with the idea to take a 14:53.700 --> 14:58.230 percentage of a business's sales as a form of paying back 14:58.320 --> 15:00.900 finance. It used to be you you know, you had to go to a bank 15:00.900 --> 15:03.360 and the bank wouldn't lend you money. That was the end of it, 15:03.360 --> 15:05.610 right? And then these payments, companies came in and said, 15:05.820 --> 15:08.190 well, we understand that you're high risk, and it's probably not 15:08.190 --> 15:11.070 a good idea to debit your bank account. But we can take a 15:11.070 --> 15:13.770 percentage of something we already have access to, and 15:13.770 --> 15:16.860 that's your credit or your debit card sales. And so that was that 15:16.860 --> 15:20.280 was the the entry point for the alternative lending industry. 15:20.310 --> 15:24.570 And in fact, that's how I got started, like, people think you 15:24.570 --> 15:28.260 know that I came strictly from small business funding or MCA, 15:28.260 --> 15:31.440 it started in payments, I was boarding merchant accounts, I 15:31.440 --> 15:35.220 was changing over hyper, hyper com T seven terminals. Honestly, 15:35.220 --> 15:38.100 I don't even know if that's like a model they use anymore. But, 15:38.460 --> 15:40.260 you know, you had to know everything about the payments 15:40.260 --> 15:43.470 industry. And so it's really not all that unusual. And what's 15:43.650 --> 15:46.080 kind of weird, I guess, you could say in a sense is that it 15:46.080 --> 15:50.070 went from payments, and then financing split off from 15:50.070 --> 15:53.070 payments and became its own thing. And then it came back 15:53.070 --> 15:57.120 around. You had companies, you have companies like PayPal and 15:57.120 --> 16:00.780 Square now doing what people think is revolutionary. Yeah. 16:00.810 --> 16:03.780 But it's actually what people were doing 10, 15, 20 years ago. 16:03.840 --> 16:05.370 Johny Fernandez: And that's something we have talked about 16:05.370 --> 16:08.850 that usually every 10 plus years, things kind of come full 16:08.850 --> 16:12.810 circle. And then we're right back with at the same topic 16:12.810 --> 16:15.600 doing the same thing. But it's just a different name. Yeah. So 16:15.600 --> 16:18.150 it's always interesting to see things come full circle. Yeah. 16:18.210 --> 16:20.940 And I think being here, it's also cool, because people have 16:20.940 --> 16:23.610 stopped you. They know who you are. They know who what deBanked 16:23.610 --> 16:26.700 is. But it's also, you know, I like being in a space like this 16:26.700 --> 16:29.760 where we can also meet other people. So if you are coming 16:29.760 --> 16:33.000 here, you know tomorrow and you see us, please stop by say hi to 16:33.000 --> 16:36.900 us. Love to meet people that are here and see them in person. 16:36.930 --> 16:39.510 Yeah. So it'll be exciting to see that. What are you looking 16:39.510 --> 16:41.730 forward to the most being here? 16:42.660 --> 16:44.310 Sean Murray: Honestly, just seeing how people interact with, 16:44.580 --> 16:47.070 how people interact with each other. You know, on the way 16:47.070 --> 16:51.600 here, I started thinking about how people pay for anything. 16:51.720 --> 16:54.630 Yeah. I think we take it for granted. Yeah. Like when we go 16:54.660 --> 16:57.210 we were at Starbucks earlier. Yeah. And we bought a coffee. 16:57.240 --> 17:01.050 Yep. And where do you know, where did that transaction 17:01.230 --> 17:02.340 happen? Do you know? 17:02.550 --> 17:02.820 Johny Fernandez: I don't know. 17:02.820 --> 17:03.630 Sean Murray: Did you think about it? 17:03.630 --> 17:04.380 Johny Fernandez: I did not think about it. 17:04.380 --> 17:05.940 Sean Murray: Well, a lot of different things happen in that 17:05.940 --> 17:08.640 whole process, right? You have all these different levels that 17:08.640 --> 17:11.250 made that transaction possible, it starts with the technology. 17:12.030 --> 17:14.490 You know, it's one of those things where, before you pay for 17:14.490 --> 17:16.890 anything, maybe take a look to see like what it is you're 17:16.890 --> 17:20.070 using, you know, what, what brand is on it. And all the 17:20.070 --> 17:22.740 different layers that go through it, you know, like people think 17:22.740 --> 17:27.090 like, oh, Visa, MasterCard, or American Express. And that's it. 17:27.210 --> 17:29.700 But you know, those are just the payment networks. And they have 17:29.700 --> 17:33.030 all these different layers in between. And for a lot of people 17:33.030 --> 17:36.300 who work in the space, they're on the frontline signing up 17:36.300 --> 17:39.210 merchants not signing up people to take payments. And that 17:39.210 --> 17:42.630 starts with offering merchants obviously, the the ability to 17:42.630 --> 17:44.850 process that might be the technology giving them like a 17:44.850 --> 17:47.760 POS system, giving them some type of terminal. A lot of 17:47.760 --> 17:50.220 people today they want you know, they want the interface for you 17:50.220 --> 17:54.600 know, on the on the monitor and all that stuff. And, you know, 17:54.600 --> 17:56.940 that that's kind of changed the game. And a long time ago, 17:56.940 --> 18:00.420 people used to be very rate sensitive. Yeah. Where you were 18:00.420 --> 18:02.220 competing on rate because everyone's technology was 18:02.490 --> 18:03.540 essentially the same. Yeah. 18:03.570 --> 18:05.880 You seem like you know what it's like to compete on rate. 18:05.910 --> 18:07.590 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, because that was something that you're 18:07.590 --> 18:11.190 like, wait a minute, it's going to charge you X, Y, and Z. If 18:11.280 --> 18:14.460 you know you use this or yeah, so. Yeah. Because there's 18:14.460 --> 18:15.630 certain scenarios that I've been in. 18:15.630 --> 18:19.590 Yeah where were you, you were in a rate, like a rate competitive 18:19.590 --> 18:23.130 environment? Yeah. So well, you know it was, back when I was 18:23.130 --> 18:25.800 doing it, it was kind of a race to the bottom. Where when you 18:25.800 --> 18:27.660 were signing, when you were competing to get a merchant to 18:27.660 --> 18:30.120 accept credit cards, debit cards, whatever. You were 18:30.120 --> 18:32.130 competing against somebody who essentially had the same 18:32.160 --> 18:34.710 technology offerings as you. Yeah. And it was a race to the 18:34.710 --> 18:38.310 bottom and who could charge the lowest rate? And for awhile, it 18:38.310 --> 18:42.090 seemed like the merchant account industry was dead. Yeah. But all 18:42.090 --> 18:44.880 this technology, it just recreated everything. Yeah. 18:44.910 --> 18:47.370 Like, when like when Square came onto the scene. And they started 18:47.370 --> 18:52.710 charging, you know, three plus percent per transaction. You 18:52.710 --> 18:55.500 know, on a swipe, right, that just changed everything, because 18:55.590 --> 18:58.920 it showed that people weren't as rate conscious, as you thought 18:59.220 --> 19:02.430 that that there was another value proposition to be had. And 19:02.430 --> 19:05.190 that just reinvented the whole whole industry. And it 19:05.190 --> 19:07.890 reinvigorated the whole thing. Everyone everyone in the chain 19:07.890 --> 19:11.550 now has a lot more to work with and then than they did before. 19:11.610 --> 19:14.520 And I think like Derek said, especially with with the last 19:14.520 --> 19:17.190 year, that was the things that we've been through the last 19:17.190 --> 19:21.450 year. Now people want to use this type of technology, because 19:21.480 --> 19:24.330 they don't want to kind of go back to what we how we were 19:24.330 --> 19:26.880 doing things before. So like you said, it's definitely brought up 19:26.880 --> 19:30.420 more and more of, you know, things like this, like the 19:30.420 --> 19:34.020 credit card processing payment industry to make, you know, it 19:34.020 --> 19:36.480 brought it back to life. Yeah. Because no one wants to do 19:36.480 --> 19:39.810 things a certain way because of what we've lived through so. 19:39.810 --> 19:40.200 Yeah. 19:40.920 --> 19:43.500 Sean Murray: Now, one thing I'll comment on individually is it's 19:43.500 --> 19:45.840 kind of anecdotal. But a long time ago when you were getting 19:45.840 --> 19:49.380 into a cab, you pretty much had to pay cash. Right? 19:49.380 --> 19:50.220 Johny Fernandez: Atleast in Manhattan. 19:50.430 --> 19:53.220 Sean Murray: Oh okay, yeah. We're New Yorkers. 19:54.480 --> 19:55.470 Johny Fernandez: In Manhattan, like. 19:55.470 --> 19:56.970 Sean Murray: In Manhattan, if you got in and you said you want 19:56.970 --> 19:59.040 to pay by credit card, there's a good chance that they will kick 19:59.040 --> 20:00.750 you out of the car. Yeah. You know, they weren't gonna they 20:00.750 --> 20:03.840 weren't going to take they didn't want you, right? That's 20:03.840 --> 20:04.800 not acceptable anymore. 20:04.800 --> 20:07.980 Johny Fernandez: No. Now, it's if you don't have a card, they 20:07.980 --> 20:11.460 look at you like, you have seven heads and they'll kick you out. 20:12.060 --> 20:15.090 Sean Murray: Have you actually gotten kicked out? Sorry, your 20:15.090 --> 20:16.680 cash is no good here. No. Did that happen? 20:16.710 --> 20:18.090 Johny Fernandez: It didn't happen. But I didn't have my 20:18.090 --> 20:21.780 credit card. And I ended up using my credit card that I had 20:21.780 --> 20:24.330 linked to my phone. So thank God, I had my phone. And that's 20:24.330 --> 20:27.810 why I paid which blew my mind even more paying with my phone 20:27.810 --> 20:31.050 now, I didnt even have to have my credit card on me, and I 20:31.050 --> 20:33.330 didn't have cash. Yeah. And the guy was like, alright how are 20:33.330 --> 20:35.850 you gonna pay? And it's like, alright, I'm gonna pay with my 20:35.850 --> 20:37.050 credit card through my phone. 20:38.010 --> 20:40.500 Sean Murray: And I think there's actually still some room to go. 20:40.800 --> 20:44.610 Being in New York, maybe we've become overly accustomed to 20:44.610 --> 20:48.090 everyone accepting credit cards. But I was in Toronto, I think it 20:48.090 --> 20:52.680 was, I guess, at this point two years ago. And I took a cab as I 20:52.680 --> 20:57.030 do. Yeah. Because I take cabs. I take cabs everywhere, right? And 20:57.030 --> 20:59.310 I want to pay by credit card, and I didn't have any cash. 20:59.340 --> 21:02.820 First of all, I was in Canada, and I didn't do any exchange for 21:02.820 --> 21:05.880 cash, I didn't even bring in American cash to exchange, 21:06.000 --> 21:08.520 right. And so I gave him a card and he still had the old, the 21:08.520 --> 21:12.180 old knuckle buster. Where they take it and they yeah. They take 21:12.180 --> 21:15.210 the imprints and the taxi driver was like 100 years old. So he 21:15.210 --> 21:18.300 was like right in his element anyway. But it goes to show that 21:18.300 --> 21:20.370 there was you know, there was still room for improvement. And 21:20.370 --> 21:24.270 even even on the way here, we were in a, we were in a cab. And 21:24.630 --> 21:28.650 I was actually with with Keith. Yeah, who was about behind the 21:28.650 --> 21:32.490 scenes, and I said I want to pay by credit card, and the guy did 21:32.490 --> 21:35.760 kind of gave me a look like, like, this is gonna be a thing, 21:35.790 --> 21:38.880 not because it cause of the fees. But because of the 21:38.880 --> 21:42.270 process. He's like, this is going to take a few minutes, you 21:42.270 --> 21:44.670 know, he had to like, take out the instruction manual, and 21:44.670 --> 21:47.460 like, read this thing and. Give these guys a hard time. All 21:47.460 --> 21:49.500 these things, all these things were happening. You know I'm not 21:49.500 --> 21:53.160 I'm not, I'm not criticizing him, right. But it just goes to 21:53.160 --> 21:57.540 show that there's still more room to go in payments, there's 21:57.540 --> 22:01.140 still more room to grow, there's still businesses out there that 22:01.140 --> 22:04.830 are not completely up to date with tech that can benefit from 22:04.830 --> 22:08.520 that kind of thing. Like you just you just see it. And it 22:08.520 --> 22:12.840 only takes a cab ride for you to find out how much you know shows 22:12.840 --> 22:14.250 like this, and people like this will like really make a 22:14.250 --> 22:15.000 difference in the world. 22:15.030 --> 22:16.950 Johny Fernandez: They do. And it's also interesting just to 22:16.950 --> 22:20.400 see the new technology that's also coming out with the growing 22:20.400 --> 22:22.770 technology, because there's two different things new and 22:22.770 --> 22:28.560 growing. And just to see how you know what's next, for the future 22:28.560 --> 22:31.800 of this industry specifically. So it's exciting to talk to a 22:31.800 --> 22:34.650 lot of the the guys here and see like, what they're doing, what 22:34.650 --> 22:37.530 they're going through, how they've recovered, and just 22:37.560 --> 22:40.740 moving forward, you know what their game plan is? So it's 22:40.740 --> 22:43.770 gonna be interesting. It's exciting. And I'm excited to be 22:43.770 --> 22:46.320 here, I'm excited to be here with you. And the gang. Yeah. 22:46.320 --> 22:49.170 Here at deBanked to just, you know, show everyone back in New 22:49.170 --> 22:52.470 York and the world. What's going on here in Florida? 22:52.500 --> 22:57.270 Sean Murray: Yeah, for sure. For sure. Just another anecdotal 22:57.870 --> 23:02.430 tidbit. I was buying lunch the other day, and I swipe my card. 23:02.820 --> 23:06.780 And they it gave me some type of reward for having gotten lunch 23:06.780 --> 23:10.050 there before. Yeah. And I'm like, how did they know who I 23:10.050 --> 23:12.990 am, had my name on the screen and all that stuff. That all 23:12.990 --> 23:16.380 comes from the tech. So if you like buy five sandwiches you get 23:16.380 --> 23:20.490 the sixth one free, I don't have to sign up for anything. It just 23:20.490 --> 23:21.990 knows automatically. It just knows. But where does that come 23:21.990 --> 23:23.850 from? It comes from the tech it comes from come from the 23:23.850 --> 23:26.700 payments companies. There's always value add products, and 23:26.700 --> 23:30.510 you know what I actually will continue to eat there, because 23:30.510 --> 23:35.550 if you get five stars. That sixth star, it's a free, it's a 23:35.550 --> 23:38.670 free sandwich, and I didn't have to sign up for anything. I 23:38.670 --> 23:40.920 didn't have, you know I didn't have to opt in. Or maybe you 23:40.920 --> 23:44.370 know what, maybe there was a button that required me to opt 23:44.370 --> 23:47.790 in. I didn't even know it. But that's just another another 23:47.790 --> 23:50.640 like, component to everything that's happening. 23:51.300 --> 23:54.150 Johny Fernandez: It's that's amazing. It's interesting to 23:54.150 --> 23:57.750 just to see how the world is overall changing. Yeah. And how 23:57.750 --> 23:59.610 they just lured you into buying a sixth sandwich. 23:59.700 --> 24:02.880 Sean Murray: Yeah, well, the sixth one is free. But but then 24:02.880 --> 24:04.800 you know what, after I get the sixth one, I'm gonna I'm gonna 24:04.800 --> 24:08.310 want more after that. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. That's 24:08.310 --> 24:11.370 cool. So we've talked a lot about payments, but there are, 24:11.520 --> 24:13.470 there are small business funding people here. 24:14.250 --> 24:15.870 Johny Fernandez: We've seen some already that they. 24:16.290 --> 24:20.220 Sean Murray: They've come up one of those one of those, right? 24:20.250 --> 24:23.880 Yeah. So the worlds are still colliding. I think it would be a 24:23.880 --> 24:26.910 mistake if anyone is out there in the Small Business Finance 24:26.910 --> 24:29.160 world, or even the financial world, forget about small 24:29.160 --> 24:31.290 business financial, if you're in finance, you have to pay 24:31.290 --> 24:33.060 attention to payments. It's a bit it's a big part of 24:33.060 --> 24:36.870 everything. Yeah. Those who are in the know are here. Maybe they 24:36.870 --> 24:40.110 don't broadcast it and advertise it on their social media. Some 24:40.110 --> 24:43.410 of them have a booth. These are, these are finance companies. 24:43.530 --> 24:46.110 Some that we would report on, normally like fintech. Yeah. 24:46.140 --> 24:49.560 Type players. And so I think that's just like proof positive 24:49.560 --> 24:52.920 that everything continues to to mess with each other. 24:52.950 --> 24:54.930 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, no it's definitely definitely 24:54.930 --> 24:55.710 interesting to see that. 24:55.740 --> 24:57.630 Sean Murray: Yeah. How about you? Are you gonna be are you 24:57.630 --> 24:59.490 gonna be looking at your green badge? Does that mean you're 24:59.490 --> 25:00.960 gonna be meshing and mingling? 25:01.380 --> 25:02.940 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, and that sort of thing. I chose this one 25:02.940 --> 25:06.690 out of all of them, because this is, I'm okay to interact. And 25:06.810 --> 25:09.390 just to get to know the guys here because, like you said, I 25:09.390 --> 25:13.350 think just the interaction overall is something that is 25:13.350 --> 25:15.990 needed, especially, you know, when you work with two different 25:15.990 --> 25:18.930 types of industries overall, you know, and you see how they 25:18.930 --> 25:22.830 collide. And you see, just, you know, without one, the other one 25:22.890 --> 25:25.470 will go missing and vice versa. So it's definitely interesting 25:25.620 --> 25:28.740 to see and to meet all these people and to see, you know, 25:28.740 --> 25:31.920 what's coming up in the future. So. Yeah. I think with that and 25:31.920 --> 25:34.860 your shirt. Yeah. I think it's going to be a good good next 25:34.860 --> 25:35.430 couple of days. 25:35.430 --> 25:36.720 Sean Murray: What, what was it Tou Tou Sean? 25:36.720 --> 25:37.230 Johny Fernandez: Tou Sean. 25:37.260 --> 25:37.620 Sean Murray: Tou Sean. 25:37.620 --> 25:38.040 Johny Fernandez: Tou Sean. 25:38.070 --> 25:39.420 Sean Murray: I don't know why I didn't think of that one. That's 25:39.420 --> 25:41.670 good, yeah that was good. Yeah, that was really good. 25:41.700 --> 25:43.410 Johny Fernandez: Well, Sean, I guess like, we'll start wrapping 25:43.410 --> 25:46.290 up now. We'll definitely be back within the next couple of 25:46.290 --> 25:48.990 minutes to speak with some more people that are on the ground 25:48.990 --> 25:49.320 here. 25:49.350 --> 25:51.240 Sean Murray: Yeah, we are gonna have some guests. Yeah. It's not 25:51.270 --> 25:54.600 gonna just be Johny and I for the entire time. No. I will be 25:54.600 --> 25:57.810 speaking with a guest. A little bit later on, not too long from 25:57.810 --> 26:01.560 now, from the, from Dedicated Commercial Recovery. You may 26:01.590 --> 26:05.310 know Shawn Smith will be with us quite soon. And. 26:05.310 --> 26:06.660 Johny Fernandez: We also have more guests coming. 26:06.870 --> 26:09.480 Sean Murray: Yeah. That's right. Before you were talking about 26:09.480 --> 26:10.080 the agenda? 26:10.320 --> 26:10.920 Johny Fernandez: Yes. 26:11.040 --> 26:12.720 Sean Murray: We are only gonna be live streaming during 26:12.720 --> 26:16.230 specific times, when the exhibit hall is open. Actually, the 26:16.230 --> 26:19.890 times are on our website. If you click an article, the article 26:19.890 --> 26:23.790 that says SEAA show, it should show you the times that we're 26:23.790 --> 26:26.250 going to be live during the exhibit hall time. So it won't 26:26.250 --> 26:29.460 be the entire day straight. But we'll we will be starting quite 26:29.460 --> 26:31.740 early in the morning. Yeah. So even before most of you go to 26:31.740 --> 26:34.140 work, so if you wake up and if you want to tune in straight 26:34.140 --> 26:38.730 away, you can go ahead and do that. debanked.com/tv or even 26:38.760 --> 26:39.660 even the homepage too. 26:39.750 --> 26:41.250 Johny Fernandez: You can do it on your phone too. We'll be live 26:41.250 --> 26:44.400 streaming from the phone. Yeah. Your website, your the computer, 26:44.400 --> 26:46.560 you can go on the website. So definitely looking forward to 26:46.560 --> 26:48.810 that and definitely looking forward to seeing you know how 26:48.810 --> 26:51.750 the rest of the day goes the event tomorrow goes. It's an 26:51.750 --> 26:54.090 exciting time to be here. And I think overall, it's exciting to 26:54.090 --> 26:58.140 be in person with people 2021 we never thought this would happen. 26:58.170 --> 26:59.310 But we are finally here. 26:59.370 --> 27:01.020 Sean Murray: I can't wait to see what happy hour looks like. 27:01.050 --> 27:03.990 I know me that's gonna be a great time. So alright, you guys 27:03.990 --> 27:07.290 from here, Bonita Springs, Florida. We will be back soon. 27:07.650 --> 27:08.670 I'm Johnny Fernandez. 27:08.730 --> 27:09.810 I'm Sean Murray, see you soon. 27:09.810 --> 27:11.070 Johny Fernandez: And this is Tou Tou Sean. 27:11.100 --> 27:11.400 Sean Murray: Tou Sean. 27:11.430 --> 27:12.120 Johny Fernandez: Tou Sean. 27:12.210 --> 27:14.070 Sean Murray: Tou Sean Sam or Tou Sean Sean. 27:14.820 --> 27:17.340 Johny Fernandez: With Sam Shapiro from Fundomate, Sam, 27:17.370 --> 27:18.870 welcome. Thank you for being here. 27:18.900 --> 27:20.730 Sam Shapiro: Yeah it's good to be here. Nice, sunny Florida. 27:20.760 --> 27:22.620 Johny Fernandez: I know. It's great. Great weather. Great. 27:22.740 --> 27:23.850 Great day so far. 27:23.850 --> 27:25.290 Sam Shapiro: Yeah. Beautiful, beautiful event. 27:25.320 --> 27:26.070 Johny Fernandez: So Sam. 27:26.070 --> 27:27.090 Sam Shapiro: Good to be back in person. 27:27.120 --> 27:28.680 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, exactly. That's what we were talking 27:28.680 --> 27:30.750 about the fact that you know, we're actually here being able 27:30.750 --> 27:33.780 to network. So Sam, let's go ahead and talk about Fundomate, 27:33.870 --> 27:36.900 kind of walk me through what you guys do. And how long ago did 27:36.900 --> 27:37.500 you guys start? 27:37.620 --> 27:39.900 Sam Shapiro: So Fundomate's been around about five years, we 27:39.900 --> 27:42.870 started out as a as an automated, like Kayak for 27:42.870 --> 27:45.570 lending for business owners that needed funding. And what we 27:45.570 --> 27:48.480 learned was, is that going directly to the businesses, when 27:48.480 --> 27:50.610 they're shopping in multiple places, it's hard to actually 27:50.610 --> 27:53.310 give the better businesses, what they're looking for. So we 27:53.310 --> 27:56.820 started a white labeled square capital model, per se, where we 27:56.820 --> 27:59.340 go to payment processors, and we offer them a white label, plug 27:59.340 --> 28:02.610 and play lending platform, funding platform. So we take 28:02.610 --> 28:05.970 data in real time, give them an API into their POS system, or 28:05.970 --> 28:08.610 any other platform or an email directly to their merchants 28:08.790 --> 28:11.520 taking processing data, what we're able to do is, is give 28:11.520 --> 28:14.340 them an offer. So the merchant clicks an offer, accepts the 28:14.340 --> 28:17.130 offer, gets funded. And it's just a one touch funding 28:17.130 --> 28:17.700 program. 28:18.540 --> 28:21.300 Johny Fernandez: Quick and easy. Yeah. One and done. So five 28:21.300 --> 28:24.720 years ago, obviously, when you guys started in the business, it 28:24.720 --> 28:27.060 was completely different than what we just went through last 28:27.060 --> 28:30.510 year, in a quick elevator elevator, like response, kind of 28:30.510 --> 28:32.520 walk me through what 2020 looked like for you guys. 28:32.520 --> 28:34.500 Sam Shapiro: So starting in March, you know, obviously, like 28:34.500 --> 28:37.650 everybody else we panicked. And then obviously, thank God with 28:37.650 --> 28:40.110 God's help the human race is resilient. And we realize how 28:40.110 --> 28:42.720 much stronger we can become. The first thing that happens is 28:42.720 --> 28:44.730 we're worried about how our collections is going to go when 28:44.730 --> 28:47.220 you have a lot of money out on the street. So thank God for the 28:47.220 --> 28:50.220 US government giving business owners money. But what that also 28:50.220 --> 28:53.580 did was is gave businesses so much money that you're competing 28:53.580 --> 28:56.220 with a trillion dollar zero interest lender, so I think 28:56.220 --> 28:58.860 everybody in this space realizes that funding slowed down, 28:59.130 --> 29:02.640 because you have people getting money from the government. But 29:02.640 --> 29:05.070 what it also did was since our model is working with payment 29:05.070 --> 29:07.980 processors, and getting a percentage of their sales, so 29:07.980 --> 29:10.860 the first couple months, sales were down, processing was down. 29:11.040 --> 29:13.710 So our collection percentage was down. But as soon as their 29:13.710 --> 29:15.930 collections went back up, we didn't have to go back into 29:15.930 --> 29:18.060 collections. We were getting a percentage of their sales. So 29:18.060 --> 29:20.070 that went back up again. But we are seeing they're coming 29:20.280 --> 29:23.400 roaring back now as the economy opens up. And I think one of the 29:23.400 --> 29:28.170 best benefits of what PPP and EIDL did was it it showed 29:28.170 --> 29:31.380 businesses that not necessarily like taking lending, and like 29:31.380 --> 29:34.380 taking money, what it ended up doing is showing them that how 29:34.380 --> 29:37.320 much value cash is for them. So now we see businesses that 29:37.320 --> 29:40.440 wouldn't actually borrow money, start borrowing money and start 29:40.440 --> 29:43.080 paying for money, because it infuses their business with 29:43.080 --> 29:43.620 growth. 29:43.860 --> 29:46.380 Johny Fernandez: So seeing obviously this difficult time 29:46.380 --> 29:49.050 you guys went through, have you guys are overcoming it. Let's 29:49.050 --> 29:52.200 look into the future in the next year. In the next five years. 29:52.230 --> 29:54.180 What does Fundomate look like to you? 29:54.480 --> 29:56.670 Sam Shapiro: So we're actually looking to start branching out 29:56.670 --> 29:59.400 into the ISO business and start providing a platform we're 29:59.400 --> 30:02.670 giving A plus businesses, programs that aren't available, 30:02.670 --> 30:05.610 like what Square's doing and Stripe's doing to the ISO model. 30:05.730 --> 30:07.980 And that's why I'm here discussing it on deBanked. But 30:07.980 --> 30:10.230 also, more importantly, we want to change how businesses look at 30:10.230 --> 30:13.170 credit, you know, any successful business in America today, or a 30:13.170 --> 30:16.500 successful financially set person has access to capital at 30:16.500 --> 30:18.840 all times, right, you pick up the phone, you get a banking 30:18.840 --> 30:21.450 line, you get a car line, you get a house line, etc. Small 30:21.450 --> 30:24.810 businesses, they're kind of have a constraint on them for access 30:24.810 --> 30:27.270 to cash, and they're always living from, you know, sale to 30:27.270 --> 30:30.240 sale. And every time a big expense comes up is when they 30:30.240 --> 30:32.520 need short term capital, what we're looking to do is what, 30:32.520 --> 30:35.520 companies like Brex, and Stripe and Square are doing and saying, 30:35.520 --> 30:37.410 hey, we want to give you a dashboard that gives you access 30:37.410 --> 30:40.800 to capital before you need it, almost like a mini VC, except 30:40.800 --> 30:42.690 we're not taking a piece of their business. So we're 30:42.690 --> 30:45.780 offering payment processors, and ISOs and businesses right now is 30:45.780 --> 30:48.510 a dashboard that kind of predicts what their processing 30:48.510 --> 30:50.940 is going to be in the future, and makes that money available 30:50.940 --> 30:53.610 for them for free, really short term. And what that does 30:53.610 --> 30:56.340 business wise, is now positions ourselves to be in front of 30:56.340 --> 30:59.520 those businesses, to be able to get them the money, they need 30:59.520 --> 31:02.460 longer term, and being able to create a network of adding 31:02.460 --> 31:03.990 businesses to that network. 31:04.410 --> 31:06.390 Johny Fernandez: That's great. That's awesome. That's exciting. 31:06.600 --> 31:09.960 Good. So as a business leader, what has this whole time taught 31:09.960 --> 31:12.000 you about moving your business forward? 31:12.420 --> 31:15.810 Sam Shapiro: So really, it's about slicing and dicing focus, 31:15.990 --> 31:18.210 and realizing, when you look at everything in a big picture it 31:18.210 --> 31:21.150 becomes overwhelming, you know, and it can become really, really 31:21.150 --> 31:24.780 scary. And everybody, at some point throughout this turbulent 31:24.780 --> 31:27.750 time was scared of something, you know, whether people did 31:27.750 --> 31:31.170 lose family members, the economy did get shut down, it's been a 31:31.170 --> 31:34.140 turbulent election period. So there's a lot going on. But when 31:34.140 --> 31:37.830 you realize that how resilient we are, and we have, you know, a 31:37.830 --> 31:39.930 God that has a plan and everything that's going on, and 31:39.930 --> 31:42.840 you really need to focus on small, you know, mini bites and 31:42.840 --> 31:45.900 small baby steps, then that's how really big things happen by 31:45.900 --> 31:47.100 taking small steps. 31:47.160 --> 31:49.740 Johny Fernandez: Awesome. And any advice to business owners 31:49.740 --> 31:53.550 that were in your shoes, you know, less than 10 years old, 31:53.550 --> 31:55.620 just trying to move forward, what advice would you give to 31:55.620 --> 31:55.860 them? 31:55.890 --> 31:58.530 Sam Shapiro: Stay calm and power on you know, that's our, one of 31:58.530 --> 32:02.550 our lending models is, you know, stay calm and finance online. So 32:02.550 --> 32:06.150 finance on dot line, you know, so it's really about really just 32:06.150 --> 32:08.700 staying in the moment because when you think too much into the 32:08.700 --> 32:11.520 past and too much into the future, there's a lot of anxiety 32:11.520 --> 32:13.920 involved in that. There's a lot of stress, there's so much 32:13.920 --> 32:16.440 overwhelming, there's there's so much to conquer. But when you 32:16.440 --> 32:19.140 stay in the moment, you realize that I just really need to take 32:19.140 --> 32:21.330 care of one step at a time. And that's really how you double 32:21.330 --> 32:23.220 down, compound and grow. 32:23.460 --> 32:25.020 Johny Fernandez: So people that are interested in checking your 32:25.020 --> 32:27.720 business out where can they go, and how can they contact you? 32:27.780 --> 32:29.970 Sam Shapiro: Sam at Fundomate.com, Fundomate 32:30.000 --> 32:32.610 automate, Fundomate.com. 32:32.880 --> 32:33.360 Johny Fernandez: Awesome. 32:33.450 --> 32:35.370 Sam Shapiro: F U N D O M A T E .com. 32:35.400 --> 32:35.940 Johny Fernandez: Thanks so much. 32:35.970 --> 32:37.500 Sam Shapiro: Thank you, man. Thank you. 32:37.650 --> 32:39.090 Johny Fernandez: Alright. Thank you guys for tuning in. Like I 32:39.090 --> 32:42.450 said, we will be back with more interviews right after this. 32:43.110 --> 32:45.720 Sean Murray: Okay, we're back. Sean Murray here again with 32:45.720 --> 32:49.800 deBanked TV. Today, my guest is Shawn Smith, the CEO of 32:49.800 --> 32:52.320 dedicated. Shawn, thanks for being here. Thanks for having me 32:52.320 --> 32:56.760 on. No problem. So Shawn, you do collections and recovery. What 32:56.760 --> 32:59.010 brings you here to the SEAA show? 32:59.670 --> 33:01.740 Shawn Smith: Well, you know we work with right now I think 33:01.740 --> 33:06.780 somewhere around 90 different companies in the alternative 33:06.780 --> 33:11.430 financing space nationwide. And I'm not sure how many payment 33:11.430 --> 33:14.280 processors we work with. But they do need our services as 33:14.280 --> 33:17.430 well. So there's cross pollination there just because 33:17.430 --> 33:20.040 we serve a lot of different asset classes on the commercial 33:20.040 --> 33:23.340 collections and legal enforcement side. So there's 33:23.340 --> 33:26.100 just several different folks that we can meet with here and 33:26.280 --> 33:30.240 clients we can hang out with. And quite frankly, there's golf 33:30.240 --> 33:33.660 and ocean and pool. So I mean, it's an easy sell from someone 33:33.660 --> 33:34.440 from Minnesota. 33:34.680 --> 33:36.660 Sean Murray: Yeah, I was gonna say, I mean, how was there a 33:36.660 --> 33:39.750 flight over was it, did you feel like you entered a whole another 33:39.750 --> 33:42.270 world, especially after post, you know, this being the post 33:42.270 --> 33:44.550 COVID error? Like, what's your take on being in this 33:44.550 --> 33:47.610 environment? Obviously, we're not wearing masks right now. 33:47.640 --> 33:50.370 Yep. A lot of people behind us are not wearing masks, it kind 33:50.370 --> 33:53.520 of feels like old times or those handshakes going, well, before, 33:53.520 --> 33:55.590 I didn't even know whether or not I should shake your hand or 33:55.590 --> 33:57.960 do an elbow bump. But, you know, what's your take coming from 33:57.960 --> 33:59.910 Minnesota, to this environment? 34:00.360 --> 34:03.060 Shawn Smith: Well, you know, look, I'm all about meeting 34:03.060 --> 34:05.970 people where they're comfortable, right. But for me, 34:06.900 --> 34:11.100 and my family, like, you know, we're very comfortable in this 34:11.100 --> 34:15.450 space. You know, I think they're still taking precautions and 34:15.450 --> 34:18.780 things like that. But I just think there's a real excitement 34:18.780 --> 34:22.680 to get back to this and still, you know, try to do it 34:22.710 --> 34:28.410 cautiously. But just a lot of optimism, and I've just seen, 34:29.010 --> 34:31.620 you know, I was getting messages when we were posting about 34:31.620 --> 34:35.040 coming down here like should I come like my LinkedIn messaging 34:35.040 --> 34:37.320 box was filling up with like what is it like who's gonna be 34:37.320 --> 34:40.470 there, but you know, and so I think they at least said they 34:40.470 --> 34:43.380 had a lot of even last minute attendees just signing up like 34:43.380 --> 34:46.050 crazy and figuring out the flights to get down here. So it 34:46.050 --> 34:49.620 feels great. I'm excited for this fall just with, you know, 34:49.620 --> 34:52.350 the Broker Fair coming and things like that. And I just 34:52.350 --> 34:56.220 think the industry as a whole is really excited to get things 34:56.220 --> 34:59.100 back going and get back in person. Sure. It's great. 34:59.580 --> 35:01.260 Sean Murray: What's going went on at Dedicated what's new at 35:01.260 --> 35:01.860 your company? 35:02.850 --> 35:06.750 Shawn Smith: You know, it's been a wild ride. I mean COVID was a 35:06.750 --> 35:10.860 roller coaster for us. You know, we have a big, about 40% of our 35:10.860 --> 35:15.120 businesses is contingency, and about 40% is first party 35:15.120 --> 35:18.960 portfolio servicing. And then the rest is a mix of repo 35:18.960 --> 35:23.700 remarketing nationwide legal and you know, just kind of ancillary 35:23.700 --> 35:28.290 things are b2b, just straight b2b stuff. And so but then by 35:28.290 --> 35:31.920 mid last year, we went on this big uptick. And then now our 35:31.920 --> 35:35.970 first party side, so what we've seen is that people are talking 35:35.970 --> 35:41.340 about portfolio management. And they're recognizing that we can 35:41.340 --> 35:45.840 take that over for them do what we do really well. And they can 35:45.840 --> 35:48.780 do the front end side really well. So we've actually grown 35:48.780 --> 35:54.300 from pre COVID, we were about 30 employees, our team members to I 35:54.300 --> 35:58.680 think we're close to 90 now. So we expanded in COVID. And we 35:58.680 --> 36:01.830 where we really expanded was on the first party side. So we 36:01.830 --> 36:05.700 start taking over folk's portfolios, managing it either 36:05.700 --> 36:09.360 on their system or on ours, and really helping them build out an 36:09.360 --> 36:13.260 airtight kind of waterfall process for every account. So 36:13.260 --> 36:16.470 that side I've seen grown, the contingency side is still behind 36:16.920 --> 36:19.230 pre COVID numbers as far as the number of accounts are coming 36:19.230 --> 36:21.390 in. But that's because they weren't writing as much. Right. 36:21.480 --> 36:25.080 So now I see everyone getting lines and stuff like that. So I 36:25.080 --> 36:28.800 really see the you know, it moving in an awesome direction 36:28.800 --> 36:33.600 quickly. But yeah, it's just been a wild ride. I mean, what a 36:33.600 --> 36:34.770 ride, you know what I mean? Like. 36:34.890 --> 36:38.310 Sean Murray: So you so you tripled in size. But what does 36:38.310 --> 36:42.060 that mean, as far as customers go like merchant does that, does 36:42.060 --> 36:44.910 that suggest that there are more people in collections and more 36:44.910 --> 36:48.450 people are paying like, how, how does a company like yours, get 36:48.450 --> 36:50.880 that growth, like what what changed what happened during 36:50.880 --> 36:52.230 COVID, to create all of that? 36:52.500 --> 36:55.290 Shawn Smith: So actually, on our third party contingency side, 36:55.290 --> 36:58.110 where we in essence, don't get paid, unless our client gets we 36:58.110 --> 37:02.340 get our client paid, that side is still down, I would say we're 37:02.340 --> 37:09.030 roughly averaging about a 50 to 60% average of what we were pre 37:09.030 --> 37:15.090 COVID. But because I think a lot of companies realized there was 37:15.090 --> 37:18.840 a lot of holes in their recovery process, they've been turning 37:18.840 --> 37:22.320 over handling their portfolio, their customer service and their 37:22.320 --> 37:24.180 collections to us. So that's really where the growth is 37:24.180 --> 37:27.840 coming from, and what's forcing the changes, you know, something 37:27.840 --> 37:30.840 I used to say is, you know, don't go out and buy the fire 37:30.840 --> 37:33.660 extinguisher when the house is on fire. And obviously, through 37:33.660 --> 37:36.600 COVID, the house was on fire. And a lot of companies, their 37:36.600 --> 37:40.260 solution was to move internal sales or underwriting over to 37:40.260 --> 37:42.180 customer service and collections. The problem is, 37:42.180 --> 37:46.650 that's not their specialty, right, and it is ours. So we 37:46.650 --> 37:49.380 were able to, for instance, we had a client that was sending us 37:49.380 --> 37:53.730 about 250 accounts a month. And they had eight folks on staff 37:53.730 --> 37:58.710 and collections plus a manager leading that we cut that down to 37:58.860 --> 38:03.090 three people with, they kept their manager work, you know, 38:03.090 --> 38:07.620 kind of managing our team remotely. And we cut it from 250 38:07.620 --> 38:10.920 accounts coming over down to sub 50. Actually, most of these are 38:10.920 --> 38:14.130 on 25, so when you're paying contingency on all those 38:14.130 --> 38:17.970 accounts, that number gets big really fast. So we can just show 38:17.970 --> 38:21.570 through the numbers that we can save our clients literally 38:21.570 --> 38:25.560 millions of dollars, for having our team what we do really well. 38:25.560 --> 38:28.530 So they can focus on doing what they do really well, which is 38:28.530 --> 38:31.950 bringing in the deals, building the customer relationship, 38:31.980 --> 38:34.920 servicing that customer on the front end. And if there's a 38:34.920 --> 38:38.040 challenge, we can handle it on the back end, and we can do it 38:38.040 --> 38:41.700 with a four. I think we're 4.9 Google's are revealing, so we're 38:41.700 --> 38:45.600 gonna protect their brand, doing that as well. So it's, it's 38:45.600 --> 38:48.300 worked out really well. So that third party side hasn't grown as 38:48.300 --> 38:51.900 much. Okay. And legal is definitely, you know, we're not 38:51.900 --> 38:55.170 doing heavy legal right now. Are we yes, in the instances where 38:55.170 --> 38:58.890 it really makes sense. But we're really focusing on building 38:58.890 --> 39:01.860 relationship with the merchants and helping them through this. 39:01.890 --> 39:04.080 And it's paying dividends for our clients. 39:04.110 --> 39:06.000 Sean Murray: So in terms of building that relationship, that 39:06.000 --> 39:11.520 means you're talking to them. How did the EIDL, the PPP, how 39:11.520 --> 39:14.730 did it play a role in a company like yours? Was it a net 39:14.730 --> 39:19.200 positive? You know, how did it change or impact your business? 39:19.590 --> 39:24.420 Shawn Smith: Oh, it was wild. It was wild. So when COVID hit we 39:24.420 --> 39:28.230 go into a nosedive, but we instantly started reaching out 39:28.230 --> 39:31.350 to everyone saying, hey, we're here to work with you. And 39:31.350 --> 39:36.690 unfortunately, that's not always in not just in this space, but 39:36.690 --> 39:39.510 just in general when someone owes you your immediate 39:39.510 --> 39:42.510 reaction, I think often when there's an emotional tie, to it 39:42.510 --> 39:45.660 being your money, right isn't the best reaction and it's not 39:45.660 --> 39:49.110 that way for us. And I believe because we did that when those 39:49.110 --> 39:52.920 funds came in, they gave the business owner confidence to use 39:52.920 --> 39:56.130 the funds that they had, but they were saying Not that they 39:56.130 --> 39:59.250 were even saying they don't have they were just that was to make 39:59.250 --> 40:02.670 sure they could take care of their family. Right? Right. They 40:02.700 --> 40:06.120 when they got back up and going, they used that money, not the 40:06.120 --> 40:09.630 PPP money. We were never asking directly for that. But they used 40:09.630 --> 40:12.720 other funds that they had they felt okay, we're paying it off. 40:12.720 --> 40:18.480 So, I mean, we had we grew by 221%. Last year on the revenue 40:18.480 --> 40:21.780 side. And a lot of that had to do with, I feel like because we 40:21.780 --> 40:25.500 treated people right through COVID, as things started opening 40:25.500 --> 40:30.330 up, they took care of us first. And so we became the priority to 40:30.330 --> 40:34.380 pay off not because of threats, right, but because of 40:34.380 --> 40:39.570 relationship. And the clients that I saw do that also had 40:39.600 --> 40:43.920 amazing results internally. And some of the ones that I know 40:43.920 --> 40:48.090 that took a more aggressive approach didn't just have 40:48.090 --> 40:51.510 collection issues, they had regulatory issues, and they had 40:51.750 --> 40:55.470 press issues and right and thankfully, that was pretty few 40:55.470 --> 40:58.320 and far between. But unfortunately, it did happen for 40:58.320 --> 40:58.710 sure. 40:59.010 --> 41:01.200 Sean Murray: Sure. So you've talked about having a 41:01.200 --> 41:03.720 relationship with the merchant, obviously, you're you're a good 41:03.720 --> 41:07.230 face, for the collections industry. And. Definitely. I 41:07.230 --> 41:09.510 know this personally, because I know you're a very charitable 41:09.510 --> 41:12.810 guy as well like what what type of charitable work and 41:12.810 --> 41:15.090 initiative has dedicated participated in? 41:16.410 --> 41:18.660 Shawn Smith: I'll try to make long story short without one. 41:18.660 --> 41:22.170 But so everything we do is tied to working with a 501 C three. 41:22.530 --> 41:25.740 So basically, we partner with 501C's that our team is 41:25.740 --> 41:28.590 passionate about, or I'm passionate about, or even our 41:28.590 --> 41:32.370 clients or the market is passionate about. So our biggest 41:32.400 --> 41:35.190 partner is Feed My Starving Children. So every time a client 41:35.190 --> 41:40.530 sends us a deal, we donate 10 meals. So by the end of 2020, we 41:40.530 --> 41:45.000 had donated over a million meals to feed children. And then once 41:45.000 --> 41:48.450 that slides over to legal team, we just went from one to two 41:48.450 --> 41:53.190 advocates in Haiti that helped find and help slaves in Haiti 41:53.190 --> 41:57.120 unfortunately has over 300,000 child slaves in and around 41:57.120 --> 42:01.290 Porter, France estimated. And so they go in and help them and so 42:01.290 --> 42:05.010 now we have two advocates that are going on, and we're able to 42:05.010 --> 42:09.480 positively impact over 72 children. We're just about to 42:09.480 --> 42:14.130 release publicly a partnership with Doran, which fights child 42:14.130 --> 42:16.680 sex trafficking and pornography on the Internet with our first 42:16.680 --> 42:20.460 party team. So we're helping stop that and infatuate that in 42:20.460 --> 42:24.150 a very positive way. We partner with American Gold Star Mothers 42:24.840 --> 42:29.430 for with a repossession remarketing, and Love Life Now 42:29.460 --> 42:31.920 to fight domestic violence, and so on so forth. It's like, 42:31.920 --> 42:36.180 literally, it's everything we're doing for every collection, or 42:36.180 --> 42:39.150 administrative or everyday you work Dedicated, there is a 42:39.150 --> 42:43.650 positive action in this world tied to it. And it's, I believe, 42:43.650 --> 42:45.330 business is going in two different directions, you're 42:45.330 --> 42:48.060 either a for profit or a for purpose, both need to make a 42:48.060 --> 42:51.810 profit to stay in business. But if people are choosing with 42:51.810 --> 42:55.830 their dollars, and they're the same price with the same, you 42:55.830 --> 43:01.290 know, roughly even success rates, but one is donating and 43:01.290 --> 43:03.990 having positive impact, especially in that sub 40 43:03.990 --> 43:07.620 category, they're gonna go with impact all day long. And that's 43:07.620 --> 43:10.140 what our brand has become synonymous with is that we can 43:10.140 --> 43:13.980 trust millions of dollars in debt, we can trust our merchants 43:13.980 --> 43:17.340 and our relationship with those merchants to know that you have 43:17.340 --> 43:20.340 a 4.9 Google start revealing that you're going to actually 43:20.340 --> 43:22.980 treat people right. For a collections? Right. So one of 43:22.980 --> 43:24.900 the findings, I just did a research on this, like two weeks 43:24.900 --> 43:30.780 ago, we actually have a higher rating on Google than most of 43:30.780 --> 43:35.670 the industry out there on equipment, finance, advanced 43:35.670 --> 43:40.290 everything right. And I was actually surprised by that. So 43:40.320 --> 43:44.220 yeah. And it bleeds through our brand and everything we do. And 43:44.220 --> 43:47.370 I'm just a big advocate that I think business has the greatest 43:47.400 --> 43:50.610 opportunity to change the world, because as this massive thing 43:50.610 --> 43:53.580 called profit that it's just been using for just the 43:53.580 --> 43:57.000 immediate stakeholders and shareholders. But when you look 43:57.000 --> 44:00.330 at it, the global economy is really helping support you doing 44:00.330 --> 44:03.360 business, not that unit. You know, look, I say sometimes 44:03.360 --> 44:07.230 we're, you know, we're a for profit, charity, right. So like, 44:07.320 --> 44:09.630 we still need to make a profit, right? I'm still a highly 44:09.630 --> 44:12.780 motivated person. I am not judging that at all. But I think 44:13.320 --> 44:16.470 business has kind of developed a bad reputation of just being 44:16.470 --> 44:20.250 about making the money. And people more and more are gonna 44:20.250 --> 44:22.770 start voting with their dollars. And I've been advising some 44:22.770 --> 44:25.800 brands in the industry to say, hey, if you want to stand out, 44:26.070 --> 44:30.060 you want a champion small business. Okay, marketing 44:30.060 --> 44:32.310 strategies and how much everyone's saying the same 44:32.310 --> 44:35.250 thing. We love small business. We're here for you. Yeah, prove 44:35.250 --> 44:38.490 it. Prove it with your time and your checkbook. If you want to 44:38.490 --> 44:42.330 stand out against your competition. Go do cool things. 44:42.630 --> 44:45.510 Just because you funded a merchant, that's great. So is 44:45.510 --> 44:48.480 your competition but go in and rock their world and do 44:48.480 --> 44:52.920 something really cool or when it doesn't maybe make sense, renew 44:52.920 --> 44:56.460 them and give them a better rate because you believe in, you know 44:56.460 --> 44:59.730 stuff like that. And then tell that story on social media with 44:59.730 --> 45:02.730 your brand. Tell the story on how you're changing merchant's 45:02.730 --> 45:06.360 lives by getting them the money they need. That is who people 45:06.360 --> 45:08.940 are gonna want to do business with, right. And I just think 45:08.940 --> 45:11.460 that you're gonna see a big shift over the next five years, 45:11.700 --> 45:14.430 where there's going to be massive opportunities to be a 45:14.430 --> 45:19.470 for purpose business, instead of a just for profit. And like I 45:19.470 --> 45:22.170 said, especially in that sub 40 category, the money's gonna go 45:22.170 --> 45:22.470 there. 45:22.740 --> 45:25.680 Sean Murray: You don't always hear about brands and social 45:25.680 --> 45:29.310 media, when you're talking about collections and recovery. You're 45:29.310 --> 45:31.320 talking about, like, a brand as if, like you're like a tech 45:31.320 --> 45:36.240 company. But you also have like a YouTube channel. Yeah. You're 45:36.240 --> 45:39.750 a very public facing company. There's nothing like mysterious 45:39.750 --> 45:40.110 or. 45:40.530 --> 45:43.680 Shawn Smith: Yeah, I mean, look at. Any, any company can do 45:43.680 --> 45:48.780 that, right? Like, we we wanted the markets and know what we're 45:48.780 --> 45:53.250 about. And we do vlog on our YouTube channel. And we post 45:53.250 --> 45:55.560 that out on all of our social medias. And we we have an 45:55.560 --> 45:58.110 Instagram, you know what I mean. Which is so funny. 45:58.680 --> 45:59.520 Sean Murray: Instagram, I like it. 45:59.520 --> 46:02.670 Shawn Smith: Yeah. And, you know, I think right now, across 46:02.670 --> 46:06.570 all channels, we have over 12,000 connections or followers, 46:06.570 --> 46:09.570 as a company as a debt collection agency that we really 46:09.570 --> 46:13.530 emanated from, and we've grown more into a portfolio management 46:13.530 --> 46:17.880 company, as well. And as a little teaser, we talked off 46:17.880 --> 46:20.010 camera about this, you'll actually see I think we'll move 46:20.010 --> 46:26.850 more towards fintech and AI and machine learning, as well. But, 46:27.660 --> 46:32.100 you know, with that said, is, it gives the marketer a way to 46:32.100 --> 46:35.940 experience your brand in a real and authentic way, when you go 46:35.940 --> 46:39.480 to Dedicated, whether it be their social media or website, 46:39.570 --> 46:42.720 it's our team in the pitchers. It's not this stock, like, hey, 46:42.750 --> 46:45.690 how you doing? You know what I mean, it's real. It's our team, 46:45.750 --> 46:49.410 I am on camera, I put my team on camera, even if they're not 46:49.410 --> 46:51.930 super excited about it, or whatever. Like, if they'll do 46:51.930 --> 46:54.600 it, I'll put on so people can see the people that are 46:54.600 --> 46:56.490 collecting that they can see that people that are running 46:56.490 --> 47:00.750 operations or finance, and they can experience and relate, well 47:00.750 --> 47:05.160 anybody can do that and the market really responds to that. 47:05.730 --> 47:09.540 And I just yeah, I'm also big advocate. I never thought, you 47:09.540 --> 47:13.560 know, I started a YouTube channel as the a, you know, the 47:13.560 --> 47:14.010 Giving Collector. 47:14.010 --> 47:15.540 Sean Murray: How would they find your YouTube channel? What do 47:15.540 --> 47:16.560 they have to type into YouTube? 47:16.590 --> 47:17.490 The Giving Collector. 47:17.520 --> 47:17.850 Okay. 47:17.880 --> 47:20.310 Shawn Smith: So it kind of sounds like an oxymoron. But, 47:20.910 --> 47:25.350 you know, again, just back to who we are, you can look up on 47:25.620 --> 47:29.310 me on LinkedIn is kind of my primary, where I focus business. 47:29.850 --> 47:32.970 But we're on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and we're 47:33.000 --> 47:36.090 we're usually posting five to six days a week. So I have an 47:36.090 --> 47:39.900 amazing person on my team Taylor, who does our marketing, 47:39.900 --> 47:43.110 who helps me out with that. And, you know, that's an investment. 47:43.320 --> 47:43.710 But. 47:43.710 --> 47:46.530 Sean Murray: I follow by the way, I follow the page. 47:46.620 --> 47:49.980 Shawn Smith: Yeah, I mean, that's, you know, we were just 47:51.450 --> 47:54.000 talking about some of the other leaders in this space that do 47:54.000 --> 47:56.550 the same thing. And when you go to these conferences, when you 47:56.550 --> 47:59.760 go out there in the market, people are like, hey, I know you 47:59.760 --> 48:04.680 and I love, this and I love that and that you know, that they're 48:04.680 --> 48:06.750 experiencing your brand authentically. So it's already 48:06.750 --> 48:09.720 done the work for you now, it's just if it makes sense to work 48:09.720 --> 48:14.730 together, you know, so I really suggest people consider that you 48:14.730 --> 48:17.490 can put just a little bit of time into LinkedIn or whatever, 48:17.490 --> 48:20.700 and it'll pay dividends long term, but you have to 48:20.700 --> 48:24.420 consistently, you know, set that aside, you know, that time 48:24.420 --> 48:27.960 aside, and, yeah, it's really added a lot of value to our 48:27.960 --> 48:32.760 brand doing that. But, you know, there always be a reason to not 48:32.760 --> 48:36.750 invest that time. And I think authenticity is the key. Sure. 48:36.750 --> 48:39.510 You know, we joked on camera that and I say, look, I live in 48:39.510 --> 48:42.030 a glass house, and I have skeletons in my closet like 48:42.030 --> 48:44.760 anyone else. And you know what, my skeletons are in a glass 48:44.760 --> 48:49.770 closet. So I'm not a perfect guy, I screw up. You know, but 48:49.980 --> 48:53.400 we are trying to do business the right way. And we want people to 48:53.400 --> 48:57.180 experience our brand in an authentic way. And what a what a 48:57.180 --> 48:59.550 tool to do that people are on their phones six, eight hours a 48:59.550 --> 49:02.670 day, and especially with COVID. Right, so they gave the 49:02.670 --> 49:07.200 opportunity for people to experience our brand and why we 49:07.200 --> 49:08.790 were different. And. 49:09.210 --> 49:10.500 Sean Murray: Because you couldn't you couldn't go to 49:10.770 --> 49:11.730 networking shows. 49:11.730 --> 49:15.270 Shawn Smith: Yeah, so yeah, it's kind of like, well, we see it, 49:15.270 --> 49:18.300 we're like, I'm not that bright. Like, I didn't come up with this 49:18.300 --> 49:23.310 idea. I saw amazing people, you know, do this, do it really 49:23.310 --> 49:26.670 well. And I just took what they did and said, okay, that's 49:26.670 --> 49:29.130 working really well for them. I'm going to try to do that too. 49:29.160 --> 49:34.740 So anyone can watch the leaders in our industry. Do that start 49:34.740 --> 49:38.040 off and I'm like, look, I'm the redheaded stepchild, right of 49:38.040 --> 49:40.560 this industry and no offense to gingers out there. I got a red 49:40.560 --> 49:44.130 beard. But, you know, like, that's kind of how we're looked 49:44.220 --> 49:46.560 we're, people don't come to these conferences typically to 49:46.560 --> 49:49.530 meet us right and that we're okay with that. So I really do 49:49.620 --> 49:53.280 try to focus on connecting brokers with funders and just 49:53.280 --> 49:55.980 helping other people do business and building relationships that 49:55.980 --> 49:56.250 way. 49:56.340 --> 49:58.020 Sean Murray: It sounds like you're a giving collector. 49:59.130 --> 50:02.640 Shawn Smith: Well, they don't, hey, you know, there's, like, I 50:02.640 --> 50:05.760 believe in servant leadership, I believe, like, if you what you 50:05.760 --> 50:08.010 put in the ground is what grows. You put corn in the ground, 50:08.010 --> 50:10.380 you're gonna get corn, right? If you put good out there in the 50:10.380 --> 50:12.690 world, if you do right by people, whether they're, I can't 50:12.690 --> 50:15.870 really do business with a broker, but if I get a broker 50:15.870 --> 50:18.360 hooked up with a couple of funding sources, and that 50:18.360 --> 50:21.390 becomes a great relationship, guess what, when they're talking 50:21.390 --> 50:23.760 with someone who needs my services, they're gonna be like, 50:23.820 --> 50:26.610 and again, if I have a social media challenge. Yeah. If I'm 50:26.610 --> 50:29.700 tuned in, I'm going to debate conferences, I'm sponsoring 50:29.700 --> 50:32.010 things people know what my brand is, guess where it's gonna come 50:32.010 --> 50:36.240 back. And I don't know the stats on this. But I feel like we're 50:36.240 --> 50:41.340 kind of the preeminent entity in this space now. And it's, it's a 50:41.340 --> 50:43.410 lot of hard work. It's a lot of grinding, it's getting 50:43.410 --> 50:47.370 everything. But it's doing these additional things that really 50:47.370 --> 50:49.980 separate yourself. Why are you different than anyone else? 50:49.980 --> 50:52.710 Right. I mean, we meet you go and you meet every funder out 50:52.710 --> 50:55.920 there, they all say they're different why, why are you a 50:55.920 --> 50:59.280 different broker? Why are you easier to work with. Right. And 50:59.610 --> 51:01.530 it just gives you an opportunity to separate yourself. 51:01.530 --> 51:03.210 Sean Murray: Well you come on the live streams, that makes you 51:03.210 --> 51:04.050 different, right? 51:04.560 --> 51:07.770 Shawn Smith: Yeah, definitely. Yeah, definitely nerve wracking 51:07.770 --> 51:09.660 for anyone who is like, you know, hey, do you want to be on 51:09.660 --> 51:11.160 camera? Sure. 51:11.220 --> 51:12.750 Sean Murray: I just pulled him out of the crowd. This wasn't 51:12.750 --> 51:14.430 even planned. Yeah. No it was planned. 51:14.490 --> 51:17.310 Shawn Smith: No, but I appreciate it. And you know for 51:17.310 --> 51:20.310 me, like deBanked has been a huge part of our business we've 51:20.310 --> 51:22.590 been involved, the only thing we ever missed, I think was your 51:22.590 --> 51:24.780 golf tournament, when you first kicked things off, I think we've 51:24.780 --> 51:29.220 been at everything since. And, you know, you've just you have 51:29.220 --> 51:31.650 such a broad range of who you're willing to bring into the 51:31.650 --> 51:34.680 industry, support them, show them the ropes, you did that 51:34.680 --> 51:39.960 with me. And, you know, I can't promote enough. Like, you need 51:39.960 --> 51:41.970 to be at these types of things. You need to be out all the 51:42.000 --> 51:45.600 deBanked stuff, you need to be meeting the funders, the service 51:45.600 --> 51:50.070 providers, the experts in our industry, and connecting with 51:50.070 --> 51:54.690 them. And I mean, just knowing you, and honestly being able to 51:54.690 --> 51:58.290 reach out and say, hey, can you know something about this or 51:58.290 --> 52:02.790 whatever, can you help me? It's been really good. I mean, it's, 52:02.820 --> 52:06.630 it's really changed our business. So you know, at a deep 52:06.630 --> 52:10.680 level of appreciation, the thankss go comes off from this 52:10.680 --> 52:11.460 corner, for sure. 52:11.670 --> 52:13.740 Sean Murray: Well, thank you, Shawn. The feeling is mutual, by 52:13.740 --> 52:16.260 the way you do you know, you put on a good face for there 52:16.290 --> 52:18.840 collections and recovery industry. I think everyone is 52:18.840 --> 52:21.480 eternally grateful for the way you present yourself for 52:21.480 --> 52:25.650 everybody else. And I want to I want to thank you for joining me 52:25.650 --> 52:27.450 here today. Really appreciate your time. 52:28.020 --> 52:30.540 Shawn Smith: Thank you for having me on. And I you know, my 52:30.540 --> 52:33.240 hope is that people see that that's authentic, that this 52:33.240 --> 52:37.170 isn't a show. I'm not just here to sell and all like this, this 52:37.170 --> 52:39.630 means the world to me who we are as a business and how we do 52:39.630 --> 52:41.700 business. And yeah, thank you for having me on. I generally 52:41.700 --> 52:42.270 appreciate it. 52:42.390 --> 52:43.260 Sean Murray: Alright. Thanks again. 52:43.260 --> 52:46.290 Shawn Smith: Hey, shake hands. Love it. Alright. Get down to 52:46.290 --> 52:46.410 it. 52:46.410 --> 52:47.040 Sean Murray: Feels good. 52:47.160 --> 52:49.530 Johny Fernandez: Welcome back, you guys. We are live here from 52:49.530 --> 52:54.240 Bonita Springs at the 21st annual SEAA annual conference. 52:54.300 --> 52:55.410 Sean, do you hear that? 52:55.500 --> 52:57.090 Sean Murray: I do, I hear music playing already. 52:57.240 --> 52:59.280 Johny Fernandez: It's it's coming to life. Yeah. We're 52:59.280 --> 53:03.510 back, we're back in full swing. We got Sean Toucan Sean or Tou 53:03.510 --> 53:10.200 Sean and Johny Fernandez here. I love the music. It's vibrant 53:10.200 --> 53:13.140 energy. Yeah. So Sean, real quick, let's really, really 53:13.140 --> 53:17.310 quick recap. So we've talked to different people in the payment 53:17.310 --> 53:21.300 world, kind of what they've told us about just being here. And 53:21.300 --> 53:25.440 also just overall, how they've moved forward after a crazy 53:25.440 --> 53:28.530 year. So you spoke with Shawn. Yeah, go ahead and walk us 53:28.530 --> 53:29.670 through that. Not this Shawn, there's another. 53:30.720 --> 53:32.790 Sean Murray: The other Shawn, Shawn Smith from dedicated, 53:32.790 --> 53:34.470 yeah, we were just talking earlier if you if you didn't 53:34.470 --> 53:37.590 catch it before. What was interesting about his firm is 53:37.590 --> 53:40.410 that he works in the collections field. And you might think 53:40.410 --> 53:42.570 intuitively, that collections probably did pretty good. 53:43.110 --> 53:45.990 Because of COVID. Because a lot of people probably had to stop 53:45.990 --> 53:47.580 their payments, pause their payments, and that would be a 53:47.580 --> 53:49.740 good opportunity for a collections firm, he actually 53:49.740 --> 53:53.130 said his company grew by three times that it went from 30 53:53.130 --> 53:57.600 employees to 90 employees. That's like a massive increase. 53:57.600 --> 54:02.100 Yeah. And part of it, it wasn't just people needing to go on 54:02.130 --> 54:06.030 collection plans or whatever. It was also, lending companies, 54:06.060 --> 54:10.410 funding companies, who realized that their own internal customer 54:10.410 --> 54:13.890 support, could not manage collections. So he saw a huge 54:13.890 --> 54:16.440 inflow for when he was telling me from companies managing their 54:16.440 --> 54:19.440 internal collections. And then finally, finally, using the 54:19.440 --> 54:21.570 resources of a third party collections companies, he said, 54:21.570 --> 54:23.880 that was like a really big part of it. Because if you work in 54:23.880 --> 54:27.660 the financial field, people like to bring things in house, not 54:27.660 --> 54:31.080 bring things, you know, to a third party where you might lose 54:31.080 --> 54:34.020 some of the control over your data. It might cost you more, 54:34.290 --> 54:36.990 but when COVID hit I think people said, okay, we can't do 54:36.990 --> 54:39.480 this on our own. And so his company actually grew by triple 54:39.510 --> 54:41.100 which I thought was unbelievable. 54:41.100 --> 54:43.860 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. And same thing which Sam Shapiro from 54:43.890 --> 54:47.400 Fundomate, similar situation, you know, he was actually, you 54:47.400 --> 54:50.160 know, COVID hit, you know, they kind of had to kind of figure 54:50.160 --> 54:52.950 out what they were going to do. They panicked, but as COVID 54:52.950 --> 54:56.610 started to go on, and that year and a half. He also, you know, 54:56.610 --> 54:59.700 pretty much ended up recovering and growing, and now they're 54:59.700 --> 55:02.070 kind of moving on to different projects. And it's really 55:02.070 --> 55:05.160 interesting to see that many people that we've talked to here 55:05.250 --> 55:09.750 in the world in the cash payment world, and sorry, credit payment 55:09.750 --> 55:12.600 world, that they are really looking forward to. 55:12.960 --> 55:15.750 Sean Murray: This is the cash conference. Only cash, only 55:15.750 --> 55:18.330 cash. That's it. Yeah no, no payments. 55:18.330 --> 55:20.670 Johny Fernandez: No payments. But it's interesting to see how 55:20.670 --> 55:24.750 like, this whole world is changing the way we live our 55:24.750 --> 55:28.560 life, because of what's happened to us. Now, everything's credit 55:28.560 --> 55:30.870 payment, you know, everything is, you know, kind of like what 55:30.870 --> 55:33.900 we talked about just, you know, through a credit card, or the 55:33.900 --> 55:37.080 different forms of payment, whether it's similar to a Square 55:37.110 --> 55:40.920 or a Venmo, or anything of that nature and seeing how quickly 55:40.920 --> 55:43.740 things have accelerated from, you know, people like a taxi 55:43.740 --> 55:46.530 driver not wanting to take credit to now like, that's 55:46.620 --> 55:48.690 pretty much the only thing they see, that's the only thing they 55:48.690 --> 55:51.030 use nowadays, especially in places like New York, where 55:51.030 --> 55:53.910 we're from. So it's really interesting to see that. And 55:53.910 --> 55:56.520 also, I think, something that we've heard from different 55:56.520 --> 55:59.640 people that we've talked to whether it was here on set or 55:59.850 --> 56:02.490 out, like, you know, just talking to people in the 56:02.490 --> 56:05.700 reception area, that people are excited to be here. They want to 56:05.700 --> 56:08.940 be here, you know, and we did speak with the event organizers, 56:08.940 --> 56:13.200 one of the guys from the board of directors, Derek, and he also 56:13.200 --> 56:16.530 chatted with us about that there's more than 900 plus 56:16.530 --> 56:17.310 people here. 56:17.610 --> 56:20.010 Sean Murray: I think he said over 1000, when he counted. 56:20.010 --> 56:21.180 Yeah, when he when he counted walkins. 56:21.180 --> 56:23.310 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, it's interesting, and you can really 56:23.310 --> 56:27.180 start, people can really start seeing just a difference, and 56:27.180 --> 56:30.180 where the world is going now that, you know, there's things 56:30.180 --> 56:32.910 like the vaccine and the restrictions are being lifted. 56:33.000 --> 56:36.180 He himself said that, you know, last minute, people were still 56:36.210 --> 56:39.720 wanting to sign up, they were walkins. And then also, there 56:39.720 --> 56:44.160 was just a change in how they were doing things on a daily 56:44.160 --> 56:48.270 basis. So something we mentioned is that the event space is back, 56:48.390 --> 56:51.510 you know, these type of events, people want to be here. And I 56:51.510 --> 56:53.820 think that's something we've talked about before, in the 56:53.820 --> 56:57.840 different shows that we've done, that people are tired of Zoom, 56:57.900 --> 57:01.860 even the owner of Zoom is Zoomed out, and people want to do this 57:01.860 --> 57:05.580 we, we've seen this area right behind us, packed with people, 57:05.700 --> 57:07.980 you know, people are enjoying themselves. And I think that 57:07.980 --> 57:11.670 what's what we miss out on the most is that people actually 57:11.670 --> 57:14.340 want to be with other people and networking and being in the 57:14.340 --> 57:17.190 flesh. I've heard people tell you, oh my gosh, you're Sean 57:17.190 --> 57:21.210 Murray in the flesh in person. So that's definitely exciting. 57:21.210 --> 57:23.220 And that's definitely the vibe we've been picking up since 57:23.220 --> 57:26.760 we've been here. And it's going to be exciting for tomorrow too, 57:26.880 --> 57:29.100 you know, different exhibits that are going to be happening 57:29.100 --> 57:31.680 exhibit halls that are going to be happening, the educational 57:31.680 --> 57:35.280 aspects of it. And also the networking, they have over 90 57:35.280 --> 57:39.870 booths here alone. So that's something you know that to take 57:39.870 --> 57:42.750 into consideration if you are coming. And then also the 57:42.750 --> 57:46.110 different protocols that they put in place. You know, despite 57:46.200 --> 57:48.810 this feeling normal, they're also taking into consideration 57:48.810 --> 57:51.750 that not everyone may feel like that, which is why we have our 57:51.750 --> 57:54.870 stickers. Yeah. We there is a yellow one, there's a red one, 57:55.020 --> 57:57.480 there's a purple one, there's is a green one, each of them 57:57.480 --> 58:00.990 signifying something different. So this one pretty much says. 58:01.020 --> 58:02.520 This means you are. Ready to party. 58:02.520 --> 58:04.890 Sean Murray: Ready to party. Yeah, I got all my shots. You 58:04.890 --> 58:08.580 know, this isn't me just being bold, this is me doing what I 58:08.580 --> 58:12.240 was supposed to do. And, and being completely safe and secure 58:12.240 --> 58:16.290 and embracing, you know, embracing the normal that I you 58:16.290 --> 58:17.520 know, took the time to consider. 58:17.550 --> 58:18.990 Johny Fernandez: And same thing I've taken the proper 58:18.990 --> 58:22.530 precautions that I probably wear the green, the green sticker, 58:22.560 --> 58:25.170 you know, ready to talk to people. And something that I've 58:25.170 --> 58:28.170 seen very interesting here is that, you know, something as 58:28.200 --> 58:32.430 simple as a simple handshake. I see people's faces light up so 58:32.430 --> 58:35.610 much, because now we're back in person. And that's something 58:35.610 --> 58:37.470 that they haven't been able to do. And many people probably 58:37.470 --> 58:40.680 thought, will we still be able to ever do something like this? 58:40.710 --> 58:43.020 Sean Murray: Some people are holding on extra tight, it used 58:43.020 --> 58:46.260 to be a format used to be a format. Hey, how's it going? Now 58:46.260 --> 58:49.800 it's like. Oh, it's so good to see you, you know yeah it's one 58:49.800 --> 58:54.720 of those. Like, oh, wow, oh you're real? It's the two hand. 58:55.980 --> 58:58.170 Johny Fernandez: That's literally the phrase of the 58:58.170 --> 59:01.410 evening is wow, you're real. Yeah. Because people have come 59:01.410 --> 59:04.590 up to you and told you that. Yeah. So you went Toucan Sam or 59:04.590 --> 59:09.030 Tou Sean. Yeah. Two Sean's you know, you guys are a hit 59:09.030 --> 59:12.720 tonight. Is that shirts that hit tonight. This shirts okay, that 59:12.720 --> 59:15.990 shirt is definitely, your wife is probably so proud of you 59:15.990 --> 59:16.530 right now. 59:16.830 --> 59:18.270 Sean Murray: I don't well, I don't know what she thinks about 59:18.270 --> 59:20.550 me right now. I guess I guess we'll find out afterwards, 59:20.550 --> 59:24.210 especially given some events that happened earlier. But, you 59:24.210 --> 59:27.090 know, when we're not on camera, we are having some sidebar 59:27.090 --> 59:30.270 conversations here and I keep using the word anecdotal, but I 59:30.270 --> 59:34.620 think it's appropriate to use because these type of events, 59:34.620 --> 59:38.220 you get the best anecdotal evidence before the statistical 59:38.220 --> 59:40.830 evidence comes in to tell you that tells you what's happening. 59:41.010 --> 59:44.430 You find out what's happening in person at a show. Yeah. Right. 59:44.460 --> 59:48.480 So people would ask me all the time, Sean, how do you have your 59:48.480 --> 59:53.190 post so tight? You know, on the industry, right? How are you so 59:53.280 --> 59:56.580 dialed in? Yeah. Well, because I go to the shows before you've 59:56.580 --> 59:59.730 gotten your quarterly report or whatever it is, whoever you paid 59:59.880 --> 01:00:02.040 to get your data from. I already know, because I already I 01:00:02.040 --> 01:00:03.750 already wanted to shows and I talked them, I'm not patting 01:00:03.750 --> 01:00:06.750 myself on the back. Yeah. But I'm saying going to these type 01:00:06.750 --> 01:00:08.760 of events, makes all the difference in the world to find 01:00:08.760 --> 01:00:12.240 out what people are saying, right. And some of the anecdotal 01:00:12.360 --> 01:00:16.350 conversations I've had, are alluding to the fact that it's 01:00:16.350 --> 01:00:19.710 not just a oh, we're recovering, I'm starting to hear some people 01:00:19.710 --> 01:00:23.730 say that it's already starting to look bigger than what it was 01:00:23.760 --> 01:00:24.660 before. 01:00:24.720 --> 01:00:26.340 Johny Fernandez: And I think something that we've heard 01:00:26.340 --> 01:00:29.970 people say here is that there's a comeback, that the comeback is 01:00:29.970 --> 01:00:32.790 here, we've talked about it before, but people are saying 01:00:32.790 --> 01:00:35.640 like, like, this is bigger, bigger is better. Bigger than 01:00:35.640 --> 01:00:38.130 the comeback. And this is something that they are ready to 01:00:38.130 --> 01:00:41.730 go full force, people here are ready to start working to 01:00:41.730 --> 01:00:45.510 recover from what they lost, and then even build off of that. So 01:00:45.540 --> 01:00:50.040 I think that within itself is very exciting to see. And to see 01:00:50.040 --> 01:00:52.800 people here down in South Florida, we've seen people that 01:00:52.800 --> 01:00:56.400 are from Florida, that are from New York, from Minneapolis, you 01:00:56.400 --> 01:00:59.370 know, from all over the country here specifically. And I think 01:00:59.370 --> 01:01:02.130 it's also interesting just to see how people have their 01:01:02.130 --> 01:01:05.430 mindset and where their minds are at not only when it comes to 01:01:05.430 --> 01:01:08.340 networking, but also with their business. And pretty much the 01:01:08.340 --> 01:01:11.010 pattern, like we've been saying is that they want to come back 01:01:11.010 --> 01:01:13.890 and they want to make sure that people are here, and they're 01:01:13.890 --> 01:01:17.310 ready to work, and they're ready to grow this, this, this space 01:01:17.400 --> 01:01:20.220 into something bigger than what it originally was. 01:01:20.280 --> 01:01:21.600 Sean Murray: You know, what could be challenging, though, 01:01:21.600 --> 01:01:23.640 about all that everyone wants to grow and get bigger. And this 01:01:23.640 --> 01:01:25.950 is, again, anecdotal evidence, but it's something I heard when 01:01:25.950 --> 01:01:29.610 I was in Miami last week, is that it's actually everyone's 01:01:29.610 --> 01:01:33.690 hiring, it seems like, but it's actually hard to get people to 01:01:33.690 --> 01:01:34.440 come work for you. 01:01:34.590 --> 01:01:36.510 Johny Fernandez: Well, and I think that goes back to what 01:01:36.510 --> 01:01:39.690 we've talked about before, just a simple fact that, you know, 01:01:39.720 --> 01:01:42.630 maybe, you know, moving, wanting to work remote, there's 01:01:42.630 --> 01:01:45.510 different factors that play into that. Maybe they're getting paid 01:01:45.510 --> 01:01:48.810 more on unemployment. So there's different factors. But I think 01:01:49.050 --> 01:01:52.680 what we can see and what we can say confidently is that people 01:01:52.680 --> 01:01:56.130 are hiring, the business is growing. Yeah. And now it's up 01:01:56.130 --> 01:01:59.730 to the individual employees, or people that are looking for a 01:01:59.730 --> 01:02:02.940 job, it's up to them what they want to do with, you know, 01:02:02.940 --> 01:02:05.670 what's out there, because the fact is that there is a comeback 01:02:05.700 --> 01:02:08.220 people, are ready to hit the ground running. 01:02:08.250 --> 01:02:10.380 Sean Murray: Yeah, you know, part of that might be 01:02:10.650 --> 01:02:13.140 unemployment benefits, you know, finally running the course, 01:02:13.350 --> 01:02:16.560 perhaps not doing any more stimulus. I'm not against any of 01:02:16.560 --> 01:02:19.980 those things in general. But I heard that it has impeded hiring 01:02:20.100 --> 01:02:22.740 in this particular field, in the alternative finance field, I 01:02:22.740 --> 01:02:26.100 heard that that has been a barrier to getting people to 01:02:26.100 --> 01:02:30.270 come on board. And so you have firms, small companies, well, 01:02:30.270 --> 01:02:33.750 large and small, that are facing that challenge of what do you 01:02:33.750 --> 01:02:37.500 do, when you have a lot of availability? Yeah. And nobody 01:02:37.500 --> 01:02:39.810 wants to come work for you. And I've heard that the restaurant 01:02:39.810 --> 01:02:43.230 industry has also been quite, hit quite hard on that note as 01:02:43.230 --> 01:02:45.720 well. And that they're, they're opening back up, everyone's 01:02:45.750 --> 01:02:47.850 everyone wants to go to restaurants again. But in terms 01:02:47.850 --> 01:02:50.910 of getting people to do that work. It's they're having a much 01:02:50.910 --> 01:02:55.170 tougher time. And that kind of feeds back into the the funding 01:02:55.170 --> 01:02:58.500 world, because people need capital to grow, they have all 01:02:58.500 --> 01:03:02.790 the other tools to grow, right. So if your job is to expand, and 01:03:02.790 --> 01:03:05.310 you get this money, and you want to hire and you can't hire, you 01:03:05.310 --> 01:03:07.470 know what I mean? Like, you need to every everything in the 01:03:07.470 --> 01:03:11.250 chain, everything in the chain needs to, to work. But on that 01:03:11.250 --> 01:03:14.250 note, though, I am still hearing despite the hiring challenges 01:03:14.250 --> 01:03:16.500 that are going on out there, that people are already 01:03:16.500 --> 01:03:20.070 reporting numbers that far surpassed their expectations, 01:03:20.100 --> 01:03:23.040 and in some cases already exceeding where some people were 01:03:23.130 --> 01:03:26.220 in 2019. You know, we we were just talking earlier that 01:03:26.670 --> 01:03:30.330 companies like Dedicated, they tripled during COVID. 01:03:30.330 --> 01:03:32.280 Johny Fernandez: And it's interesting, because like you 01:03:32.280 --> 01:03:35.640 said, like they did not expect that. And even the turn out for 01:03:35.640 --> 01:03:37.980 something as simple as this event. In the beginning the 01:03:37.980 --> 01:03:40.620 event organizers specifically said, oh, we're gonna probably 01:03:40.620 --> 01:03:44.520 reach 700. And then they started seeing the patterns that were 01:03:44.520 --> 01:03:46.830 coming on. And they're like, no, wait a minute, this might go 01:03:46.830 --> 01:03:51.570 from 900 plus, because of how fast just everything is moving, 01:03:51.600 --> 01:03:54.660 all of a sudden. And just to growth. And just a simple fact 01:03:54.660 --> 01:03:57.660 that people, I believe from what we've seen throughout the last 01:03:57.660 --> 01:04:01.200 couple of months that people want to get out of that normal, 01:04:01.350 --> 01:04:04.560 you know, that COVID world, people want to forget about that 01:04:04.560 --> 01:04:07.740 and move on with their life. And never remember any of this. And 01:04:07.740 --> 01:04:11.040 that's something we talked about once all this changes and 01:04:11.130 --> 01:04:13.470 restrictions are lifted and things go back to normal. We 01:04:13.500 --> 01:04:15.930 don't want to remember any of this ever again. Yeah, cause I 01:04:15.930 --> 01:04:18.690 stress. Yeah. Like I don't and I don't know if you feel that way. 01:04:18.690 --> 01:04:20.160 But I'm ready to move on with my life. 01:04:20.160 --> 01:04:21.540 Sean Murray: Yeah, no thank you, no part of that. Yeah. 01:04:21.570 --> 01:04:23.250 Johny Fernandez: So it's interesting and businesses are 01:04:23.250 --> 01:04:25.980 growing at the end of the day. Yeah, it's exciting to see that, 01:04:26.100 --> 01:04:30.360 but also employment and that aspect, you know, that also kind 01:04:30.360 --> 01:04:33.180 of has to go hand in hand. So definitely something for people 01:04:33.180 --> 01:04:36.300 to look into. If they want a job. And if they're looking for 01:04:36.300 --> 01:04:39.810 a job. This space, they're hiring, they're growing, and 01:04:39.810 --> 01:04:42.090 they're gonna keep on going and they've already grown. 01:04:42.480 --> 01:04:44.580 Sean Murray: Yeah. And it's true. 01:04:44.610 --> 01:04:45.870 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, I'm excited. 01:04:45.900 --> 01:04:47.820 Sean Murray: Yeah, you know, I guess we'll, I guess we'll find 01:04:47.820 --> 01:04:51.600 out what happens you know, New York is coming roaring back. 01:04:52.380 --> 01:04:53.850 Miami felt like it was back. 01:04:53.880 --> 01:04:55.920 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, like two years. 01:04:55.920 --> 01:04:59.130 Sean Murray: Yeah. Yeah, Miami has been back. 01:04:59.130 --> 01:04:59.460 Johny Fernandez: Been back. 01:04:59.490 --> 01:05:02.790 Sean Murray: You know, for a while so I guess we'll just 01:05:02.790 --> 01:05:03.450 continue to see. 01:05:03.480 --> 01:05:06.240 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. And I think as we continue to go 01:05:06.240 --> 01:05:09.630 throughout the next couple of hours, and we're here at the 01:05:09.630 --> 01:05:11.850 event, we'll definitely be hearing from different people. 01:05:11.910 --> 01:05:15.360 So tomorrow we'll be hearing from different people in this 01:05:15.360 --> 01:05:18.810 space and kind of see what they have to say about, you know, the 01:05:18.810 --> 01:05:22.560 future, their future, their growth. And I think we're gonna 01:05:22.560 --> 01:05:25.590 see similar patterns throughout the next couple of guests that 01:05:25.590 --> 01:05:29.940 we speak that we speak with, and also to hear the speakers of the 01:05:29.970 --> 01:05:32.460 different exhibits that are gonna be happening, and kind of 01:05:32.460 --> 01:05:35.520 see what they say and how, change, how the industry has 01:05:35.520 --> 01:05:39.330 changed and what it will be moving forwards. You know, how 01:05:39.360 --> 01:05:40.380 it will be moving forward. 01:05:40.410 --> 01:05:42.330 Sean Murray: Yeah, it will be interesting to see what happens 01:05:42.330 --> 01:05:46.110 later tonight. Yeah. Because happy hours, cocktail hours, big 01:05:46.110 --> 01:05:48.150 part of his events, you know, it's an essential part of 01:05:48.150 --> 01:05:52.830 networking. And I know how it goes normally. Yeah. This is not 01:05:52.830 --> 01:05:57.600 baby steps to in person events. This isn't like, you know, like 01:05:57.600 --> 01:06:00.540 a meeting. Yeah. This isn't like 50 people got together, we're 01:06:00.540 --> 01:06:03.870 trying it out. We went right from nothing to 1000, 1000 01:06:03.900 --> 01:06:06.660 people. And I'm really curious to see how it all how it all 01:06:06.660 --> 01:06:11.580 plays out. And I hope people kind of kind of ease themselves 01:06:11.580 --> 01:06:13.920 into it. Yeah. And don't get too out of control. I'm not saying 01:06:13.920 --> 01:06:16.950 that they are here. But in terms just generally, around the 01:06:16.950 --> 01:06:19.530 world, because I'm imagining this is Bonita, Bonita Springs, 01:06:19.530 --> 01:06:22.260 Florida. Yeah. I'm trying to think of what Vegas is going to 01:06:22.260 --> 01:06:22.710 be like. 01:06:23.280 --> 01:06:24.360 Johny Fernandez: What Miami is. 01:06:24.390 --> 01:06:25.260 Sean Murray: What Miami's gonna be like. 01:06:25.260 --> 01:06:27.060 Johny Fernandez: We already kind of know how that. Yeah. That's 01:06:27.060 --> 01:06:29.850 gone. Yeah, New York. And New York, is already already 01:06:29.850 --> 01:06:33.180 starting to get. I feel like New York is like baby steps. We hit 01:06:33.180 --> 01:06:35.100 the ground running. So it is going to be interesting to see 01:06:35.130 --> 01:06:38.640 what happens. Yeah. And how, you know, everything progresses 01:06:38.640 --> 01:06:41.190 throughout the next couple of months. And, you know, in the 01:06:41.190 --> 01:06:43.650 next couple of hours, we'll definitely see how things turn 01:06:43.650 --> 01:06:46.350 out here. So it's definitely going to be interesting to see. 01:06:46.530 --> 01:06:49.230 Sean Murray: We are seeing a lot of capital raising. Yeah. We're 01:06:49.230 --> 01:06:54.480 seeing lines of credit. We're seeing acquisitions. I mean, so 01:06:54.480 --> 01:07:01.710 much that it's like a period. It reminds me of the .com. Yes. Era 01:07:01.710 --> 01:07:04.470 in a way or does it just there's so much so much. There's so much 01:07:04.800 --> 01:07:07.530 going on. And it's happening side by side with what's 01:07:07.530 --> 01:07:10.680 happening in the crypto market. Yeah. Right. So it's like, if 01:07:10.680 --> 01:07:14.040 you go on Twitter, it looks like 1000 deals are happening a day. 01:07:14.130 --> 01:07:16.950 Yeah. And it gets you like, pumped up and excited. Yeah. And 01:07:16.950 --> 01:07:20.280 there's a lot of reason for optimism. And I think that there 01:07:20.280 --> 01:07:23.100 was a period of time when in the alternative finance space, where 01:07:23.100 --> 01:07:26.910 the capital raising kind of died down. We had this big, it was 01:07:26.910 --> 01:07:29.940 kind like a bubble. Right? It was the hot sexy thing. Everyone 01:07:29.940 --> 01:07:31.950 wanted to get a piece of it. They didn't understand it. They 01:07:31.950 --> 01:07:34.080 didn't know if it made money or not. But everyone was about 01:07:34.080 --> 01:07:36.870 scale, you know, how much can you fund, whatever. And it just 01:07:36.870 --> 01:07:41.190 shot right up. Everyone got their fill. It came right down. 01:07:41.250 --> 01:07:44.040 And we had that what we call it really like the maturity phase. 01:07:44.070 --> 01:07:47.910 Yeah. And that's okay. It's okay. It's okay to go into the 01:07:47.910 --> 01:07:49.740 maturity phase. Because you can't be in an industry where 01:07:49.740 --> 01:07:52.470 you have hundreds of new players coming in every single day, 01:07:52.800 --> 01:07:55.350 forever. At some point, you gotta have this weeding out 01:07:55.350 --> 01:07:58.890 process and you just gotta be your standard players. But all 01:07:58.890 --> 01:08:01.470 of a sudden, it's starting to feel like we're on that upswing 01:08:01.470 --> 01:08:04.500 again, because we're seeing new companies come in too. Yeah. I 01:08:04.500 --> 01:08:06.420 mean, we can see that just because I you know, I see 01:08:06.420 --> 01:08:09.390 registrations on DailyFunder, registrations on deBanked, 01:08:09.720 --> 01:08:12.420 companies I've never heard of before. So when we say coming 01:08:12.420 --> 01:08:15.450 back, and you know, bigger than before and all this stuff. 01:08:15.690 --> 01:08:17.160 Johny Fernandez: That's literally what it means because 01:08:17.160 --> 01:08:17.730 we're seeing it. 01:08:17.730 --> 01:08:20.189 Sean Murray: And it's it's yeah, not just the same old companies 01:08:20.189 --> 01:08:23.069 that are oh, we're doing, you're doing good. Now. We're literally 01:08:23.069 --> 01:08:26.699 seeing new players come into the space. We just reported on a 01:08:26.699 --> 01:08:29.759 company based out of California, they just raised a massive line 01:08:29.759 --> 01:08:33.089 of credit. I think it was around $20 million, extendable up to 01:08:33.149 --> 01:08:36.209 $30 million. This is their first line. This is this is a brand 01:08:36.209 --> 01:08:38.549 new company. Now the owners of the company have a lot of 01:08:38.549 --> 01:08:41.429 experience in the industry. Yeah. But they can start a brand 01:08:41.429 --> 01:08:46.439 new company. Now, post COVID and raise $20 million. I think that 01:08:46.439 --> 01:08:50.399 says a lot. Because the the wisdom was it's too late to 01:08:50.399 --> 01:08:53.099 start a company. You kind of missed the boat. But we're 01:08:53.099 --> 01:08:54.119 already seeing that's not the case. 01:08:54.120 --> 01:08:57.030 Johny Fernandez: No. Because you can. Yeah, well now, I feel like 01:08:57.030 --> 01:09:00.240 now from what we've seen and what we've reported on, now's 01:09:00.240 --> 01:09:03.480 the time. If you want to start a business or get into whether 01:09:03.480 --> 01:09:06.450 it's this business, alternative finance, fintech, now's the time 01:09:06.450 --> 01:09:10.020 to do it. Because the boat is still there. Yeah. If you don't 01:09:10.020 --> 01:09:13.440 jump on it now. And they wait a year or two, the boat will have 01:09:13.440 --> 01:09:16.110 sailed already. And you know, it'll they'll miss it. 01:09:16.170 --> 01:09:18.420 Sean Murray: Yeah, I think we said during one of these, one of 01:09:18.420 --> 01:09:23.340 these streams, is that people's mindset change. Yeah. Because 01:09:23.340 --> 01:09:26.070 they realize that the world could kind of stop at any time. 01:09:26.100 --> 01:09:30.240 Yeah. And you don't want to have regret. Yeah. Like, all of a 01:09:30.240 --> 01:09:32.400 sudden, all the things you want to do. You couldn't even do even 01:09:32.400 --> 01:09:34.770 if you wanted to do them. Yeah. So the opportunity was off the 01:09:34.770 --> 01:09:39.300 table. Now that the opportunity is is here again, I think that 01:09:39.330 --> 01:09:42.510 people should take it as a wake up call, like it's now or never. 01:09:42.540 --> 01:09:44.610 Yeah. You're either going to do this or you're not going to do 01:09:44.610 --> 01:09:47.070 this. And there are people doing it starting brand new companies 01:09:47.340 --> 01:09:50.250 and raising money in industries that are quite mature that have 01:09:50.250 --> 01:09:53.160 been around for a while. So if you're out there wondering like, 01:09:53.550 --> 01:09:55.500 you know, maybe it's not a good time, this would probably be the 01:09:55.500 --> 01:09:57.870 last good time you'll ever have, to be honest. 01:09:57.960 --> 01:10:00.840 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. And we literally got out to a point in 01:10:00.840 --> 01:10:05.610 the world where it stopped. And it's still kind of there. Like, 01:10:05.790 --> 01:10:09.720 we're going back full swing into things. But we're not there yet. 01:10:09.720 --> 01:10:12.450 So this is the opportunity. And like I said, we've talked to a 01:10:12.450 --> 01:10:15.150 lot of these guys today. And they've said, they're expanding 01:10:15.150 --> 01:10:17.940 and they're growing. And now's the time to hop on. Because if 01:10:17.940 --> 01:10:21.330 you don't, you're gonna lose the chance. Yeah. And like you said, 01:10:21.330 --> 01:10:23.850 it's the last time to do something like this it's the 01:10:23.850 --> 01:10:28.170 last good chance. Yeah. So it's exciting. So we'll definitely 01:10:28.170 --> 01:10:30.930 keep everyone updated in regards to what to what tomorrow will 01:10:30.930 --> 01:10:33.390 bring tomorrow, we'll have a number of interviews with 01:10:33.390 --> 01:10:36.480 different people with different businesses and different, you 01:10:36.480 --> 01:10:40.380 know, people in this space. You hear that? I do. Do you hear 01:10:40.380 --> 01:10:43.350 that? Yeah. It's exciting. It's that's the reception. Yeah. 01:10:43.350 --> 01:10:46.290 That's going on. And then throughout the day, we'll give 01:10:46.290 --> 01:10:49.020 you guys some footage of what's going on inside there to show 01:10:49.020 --> 01:10:52.110 you guys just like the atmosphere that's going on, and 01:10:52.110 --> 01:10:55.680 then that will pretty much be what we will, that will be what 01:10:55.860 --> 01:10:58.890 we will be bringing to you guys tomorrow. Yeah. And then Sean, 01:10:58.890 --> 01:11:01.770 hopefully, you wear another one of these exciting shirts. I'm 01:11:01.770 --> 01:11:02.550 excited to see what. 01:11:02.580 --> 01:11:04.620 Sean Murray: I got a whole wardrobe full. Yeah. 01:11:04.890 --> 01:11:06.990 Johny Fernandez: Alright and if you guys liked this show, you 01:11:06.990 --> 01:11:10.650 can comment on Twitter, on Facebook, you know, whatever, on 01:11:10.650 --> 01:11:12.990 deBanked, send us an email by what you guys think about this 01:11:12.990 --> 01:11:16.770 shirt about Tou Sean. And that will be exciting. That will be 01:11:16.770 --> 01:11:20.400 it. I'm excited for the rest of this event. And you know, we'll 01:11:20.400 --> 01:11:21.600 see what happens tomorrow. 01:11:21.630 --> 01:11:23.850 Sean Murray: Yeah, and I want to say thank you to the Southeast 01:11:23.850 --> 01:11:26.220 Acquirers for even having us here and and allowing us to do 01:11:26.220 --> 01:11:31.800 this been a great benefit to us. We hope that the attendees like 01:11:31.800 --> 01:11:33.630 it, we hope that if you're watching it that you get some 01:11:33.630 --> 01:11:35.820 value out of it. You know, we we just want to show you what's 01:11:35.820 --> 01:11:38.070 happening out there in the industry, that people are back 01:11:38.070 --> 01:11:39.810 together, we want to tell you what's happening in payments. 01:11:39.900 --> 01:11:42.930 It's all related. And so Southeast Acquirers, you know, 01:11:42.930 --> 01:11:45.900 thank you so much for having us here. It's a great show. The 01:11:45.900 --> 01:11:49.020 fact that they they've been able to put on a show with 1000 01:11:49.020 --> 01:11:52.470 people, already. I mean, I gotta tell you, I don't think I don't 01:11:52.470 --> 01:11:54.600 think that we would have been capable to do to do something 01:11:54.600 --> 01:11:58.350 like that so soon. So I mean, you know, my hat is off to them. 01:11:58.350 --> 01:12:00.330 That's pretty amazing. So you know great job, and they're 01:12:00.330 --> 01:12:02.430 doing awesome things, for the payments industry. 01:12:02.850 --> 01:12:04.560 Johny Fernandez: And we're excited to see you guys right 01:12:04.560 --> 01:12:07.380 here tomorrow morning. We'll be live streaming throughout the 01:12:07.380 --> 01:12:09.120 day. For more of that information. You can go ahead 01:12:09.120 --> 01:12:12.330 and check that out online. So for now, I'm Johny Fernandez, 01:12:12.330 --> 01:12:14.790 here live from Bonita Springs, Florida. 01:12:15.570 --> 01:12:16.650 Sean Murray: I'll see you tomorrow. 01:12:16.770 --> 01:12:18.840 Johny Fernandez: And who is this guy? Tou Sean? 01:12:18.840 --> 01:12:20.100 Sean Murray: Tou Sean, Sean. 01:12:21.360 --> 01:12:22.560 Alright, we'll see you guys next time.