00:01.920 --> 00:07.950 Sean Murray: I think that means we're live. Okay. Hello. 00:08.830 --> 00:10.270 Johny Fernandez: You guys welcome back. I'm Johny 00:10.270 --> 00:11.050 Fernandez. 00:11.320 --> 00:13.300 Sean Murray: I'm Sean Murray with deBanked. Thanks for 00:13.300 --> 00:14.200 joining us again. 00:14.560 --> 00:17.050 Johny Fernandez: So Sean, let's um, how are you? I know last 00:17.050 --> 00:19.750 time you were here alone. So now we're back. 00:20.050 --> 00:21.790 Sean Murray: And you look a little tan. You go somewhere? 00:21.820 --> 00:23.410 Johny Fernandez: I did. I was down in Miami. 00:23.440 --> 00:23.800 Sean Murray: Oh, yeah. 00:23.830 --> 00:25.660 Johny Fernandez: So we have a special coming up. So it's 00:25.660 --> 00:27.310 exciting. We're working on that. 00:27.340 --> 00:29.470 Sean Murray: Did you? Did you interview anyone special too? 00:29.510 --> 00:31.850 Johny Fernandez: We did, we ended up interviewing Miami's 00:31.850 --> 00:35.660 mayor. So that's exciting. He has a lot of interesting things 00:35.660 --> 00:38.090 to say about what's going on the business and the industry and 00:38.090 --> 00:41.480 FinTech. So everything down there, what's going on down 00:41.480 --> 00:45.110 there? We're gonna preview that and kind of give the whole story 00:45.111 --> 00:47.030 later on in the week. So that's exciting. 00:47.031 --> 00:48.650 Sean Murray: It should definitely be. 00:48.710 --> 00:50.870 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, and it's also seeing all the changes. And 00:51.110 --> 00:53.780 we'd also spoke with different business owners down there. So 00:53.780 --> 00:57.260 it's definitely a piece that I'm excited to work on. 00:57.350 --> 00:58.970 Sean Murray: Awesome. Well, I can't wait to show it to 00:58.970 --> 00:59.450 everybody. 00:59.480 --> 01:01.160 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, so it's gonna be a good one. It's gonna 01:01.160 --> 01:05.630 be definitely gonna be a good one. So, but big, big Monday, 01:05.630 --> 01:09.710 busy Monday, so let's start with LoanMe. LoanMe has been 01:09.710 --> 01:12.470 acquired. That's big breaking news. So why don't we talk a 01:12.470 --> 01:14.930 little about that, that announcement that was made by 01:14.930 --> 01:16.040 NextPoint. So 01:16.040 --> 01:16.640 Sean Murray: Sure. 01:16.760 --> 01:17.120 Johny Fernandez: Good. 01:17.690 --> 01:20.810 Sean Murray: Sure. So NextPoint is essentially a newly created 01:20.810 --> 01:25.280 company. It didn't really exist before it was formulated out out 01:25.280 --> 01:34.190 of a PAC. Not a PAC is SPAC. Thinking politics. SPAC. And 01:34.580 --> 01:37.670 this company was formed, I believe in October, November of 01:37.670 --> 01:38.450 last year, 01:38.690 --> 01:39.560 Johny Fernandez: Oh it's fairly new. 01:39.830 --> 01:41.780 Sean Murray: Yeah. And it was it was a joint acquisition they 01:41.780 --> 01:44.630 acquired not only LoanMe, but also Liberty, Liberty Tax. 01:44.720 --> 01:45.020 Johny Fernandez: Okay. 01:45.050 --> 01:46.580 Sean Murray: Are you familiar with Liberty Tax like they have 01:46.581 --> 01:48.850 Johny Fernandez: The Statue of Liberty is their icon. 01:49.090 --> 01:51.490 Sean Murray: It's their icon, and they have storefronts all 01:51.490 --> 01:55.870 over the country. And they actually have the Liberty Mascot 01:55.870 --> 01:57.340 where you can actually see people on the side of the road 01:57.340 --> 02:02.500 wearing statues. Full costume. And so that's now going to be 02:02.500 --> 02:06.700 part of like the the LoanMe family. And they're now combined 02:06.700 --> 02:09.730 and called NextPoint or NextPoint Financial. 02:09.750 --> 02:13.080 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. So it's a good combination of both 02:13.290 --> 02:14.370 NextPoint and 02:14.910 --> 02:19.320 Sean Murray: Of the tax and the lending business, right. So I 02:19.320 --> 02:21.690 was actually asked to write, in the news just came out today, 02:21.750 --> 02:24.840 right. So we only we only have so much information. It was 02:24.840 --> 02:28.650 disclosed publicly, they filed on the, it's they're listed on 02:28.650 --> 02:31.440 the Toronto Stock Exchange, and all that information is public. 02:31.830 --> 02:36.480 So there's like 38 pages of the 38 page investor presentation 02:36.480 --> 02:39.420 online, that anyone can go and check out we have it up on our 02:39.420 --> 02:42.060 site, actually go to deBanked.com you can find a link 02:42.060 --> 02:45.060 to the 38 page investor presentation. And you can read 02:45.060 --> 02:47.400 the whole thing, find out all the details about what the 02:47.400 --> 02:51.000 combined two companies will mean. Of course, people already 02:51.000 --> 02:52.350 asking me what does it mean? 02:52.410 --> 02:52.800 Johny Fernandez: Yeah 02:52.830 --> 02:55.860 Sean Murray: And it's really, you know, how the two of you 02:55.860 --> 02:56.460 makes sense. 02:56.460 --> 02:56.850 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. 02:57.030 --> 02:58.350 Sean Murray: You know, you think Liberty Tax. 02:58.350 --> 02:58.590 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. 02:58.620 --> 03:00.330 Sean Murray: Right. Everyone knows that. And then on the 03:00.330 --> 03:02.610 other side, all of a sudden, you have this company called LoanMe 03:02.640 --> 03:06.570 does, they actually do consumer loans and business loans, and as 03:06.570 --> 03:10.080 they recently disclosed, they also do a little bit of MCA, as 03:10.080 --> 03:13.890 well. But how did the two, how did the two really like, you 03:13.890 --> 03:18.570 know, what's the sort of the way that they mesh? It's a it, comes 03:18.570 --> 03:24.360 down to Liberty Taxes business, because a lot of people go into 03:24.360 --> 03:28.170 an actual tax, they go to a tax office to file their taxes at 03:28.170 --> 03:31.980 the end of every year, like an H&R Block. Yeah. And that puts 03:31.980 --> 03:34.530 them in touch with a lot of business owners. And I think 03:34.530 --> 03:40.020 they actually disclose that they work with about 485,000 small 03:40.020 --> 03:45.960 businesses every year, this is Liberty Tax. So you have 485,000 03:45.960 --> 03:48.240 small businesses every year using Liberty Tax to file their 03:48.240 --> 03:51.450 returns. And guess what, it's very popular to try to get a 03:51.450 --> 03:55.080 loan on your future, you know, your future return. Right. 03:55.350 --> 03:58.950 So, you know, in terms of making an all in one stop, you can also 03:58.950 --> 04:01.650 get funded presumably at least apply for a LoanMe loan. 04:01.690 --> 04:02.140 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. 04:02.320 --> 04:04.390 Sean Murray: At the at the office there. 04:06.130 --> 04:08.950 Johny Fernandez: You know, something that they, the company 04:08.950 --> 04:13.420 said from this is from their actual statement, it said they 04:13.420 --> 04:16.000 are "A one stop financial services, destination, 04:16.300 --> 04:19.000 empowering, hardworking and credit challenged consumers and 04:19.000 --> 04:22.420 small businesses to go to the NextPoint in the financial 04:22.420 --> 04:22.810 future." 04:22.840 --> 04:24.640 Sean Murray: Ok good, so that's where the NextPoint comes from. 04:24.640 --> 04:27.370 I didn't know totally even missed that part. But yeah, that 04:27.370 --> 04:31.450 all makes sense. And I think it's interesting that in the 04:31.450 --> 04:34.450 world of FinTech, that this deal essentially merges an online 04:34.450 --> 04:38.950 lender with a storefront business. I know that when 04:38.950 --> 04:42.130 people are filing their taxes, you can use an online software. 04:42.160 --> 04:45.340 Yeah, but a lot of people still choose to go to the storefront 04:45.700 --> 04:50.920 Tax Office, right? And so who their competition be? Well, 04:50.950 --> 04:53.680 it's not the first time that we've had a tax company merged 04:53.680 --> 04:58.090 with an online lender we have Intuit with QuickBooks. 04:58.510 --> 05:01.420 QuickBooks is very popular account software, a tax 05:01.420 --> 05:05.650 software. And they have their own online lending arm called 05:06.010 --> 05:10.120 QuickBooks Capital. And so they've already merged the two 05:10.120 --> 05:13.720 successfully. So I'm not surprised to see Liberty Tax 05:14.020 --> 05:18.130 merge with, you know, with LoanMe. And I think this is the 05:18.130 --> 05:21.610 first case, though, that we're seeing that an online lender has 05:21.610 --> 05:24.670 merged with a storefront. Yes, if I'm not mistaken, that 05:24.670 --> 05:27.700 that part of it is, is pretty uncommon. But the pairing of two 05:27.700 --> 05:30.820 different things to try to create an ecosystem is not that 05:31.360 --> 05:34.030 is not that strange, you know, we have Square with payments, 05:34.330 --> 05:38.260 and loans. And, you know, we have other other companies that 05:38.260 --> 05:40.270 are trying to merge two different things together. 05:40.270 --> 05:42.700 And so that they're not just an online lender, there's something 05:42.700 --> 05:44.950 else too good way to diversify your business. 05:44.980 --> 05:46.480 Johny Fernandez: Do you think this is something that we can 05:46.480 --> 05:49.540 start seeing more often, like, as you move into the future that 05:49.540 --> 05:52.210 these type of companies are merging together? Or do you 05:52.210 --> 05:54.580 think this is gonna be like, you know, they're just trying this 05:54.580 --> 05:57.250 out? And like you said, just creating something new, will 05:57.251 --> 05:58.990 people follow? Will businesses follow 05:58.991 --> 06:03.340 Sean Murray: I definitely think we'll see more. And I think, for 06:03.340 --> 06:07.660 a long period of time, people, expected online lenders to 06:07.660 --> 06:11.140 acquire other online lenders. But there's really no point to 06:11.140 --> 06:14.980 that unless they do something entirely different than what the 06:14.980 --> 06:19.270 other company already does. And so I think we'll see more online 06:19.270 --> 06:23.500 lenders merge with companies that offer a different type of 06:23.950 --> 06:28.330 business facing product, right? Like QuickBooks Capital, they 06:28.330 --> 06:32.710 lead in with their QuickBooks software, the Intuit QuickBooks 06:32.710 --> 06:36.370 software, and then you can get a QuickBooks Capital loan, but 06:36.370 --> 06:39.730 their business is really the software first, right? It's kind 06:39.730 --> 06:42.220 of like that with Square, you use square for payments, and 06:42.220 --> 06:45.550 then you can add the capital portion to it. That's really the 06:45.550 --> 06:47.770 best way to beat from a diversification standpoint, 06:47.770 --> 06:50.080 because if you have another pandemic, and you're a lending 06:50.080 --> 06:53.800 company only, or an MCA funding company only, and you have 06:53.800 --> 06:56.260 nothing else, well, then you're going to be in a lot of trouble. 06:56.260 --> 07:00.130 And that's what we've actually seen. A good example is OnDeck. 07:00.880 --> 07:04.840 One of the few online FinTech companies, that was pure lending 07:04.870 --> 07:07.240 didn't really have anything else. And of course, when the 07:07.240 --> 07:10.720 pandemic hit, they suffered greatly. And so they were 07:10.720 --> 07:14.470 acquired, but it was more of a more of a distressed, you know, 07:14.470 --> 07:18.220 acquisition type situation. And, yeah, so I think 07:18.220 --> 07:21.490 we'll see more online lending companies merged with companies 07:21.490 --> 07:24.970 that can offer a business facing product, and the lending kind of 07:24.970 --> 07:26.920 becomes an ancillary value add. 07:27.040 --> 07:29.920 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. To me is to see what happens, and how can 07:29.920 --> 07:33.910 they move forward? So for sure. So the next story is something 07:33.910 --> 07:36.280 that caught my attention. And we've been talking about it here 07:36.280 --> 07:40.210 in the office is a big league advanced to baseball players. So 07:40.750 --> 07:43.120 it's something that you just found out about not that long 07:43.120 --> 07:46.240 ago. And it's been around since 2016. So it's been around for a 07:46.240 --> 07:49.840 while. So let's go ahead and start talking about that kind of 07:50.080 --> 07:53.290 just a concept that it's not a merchant cash advance, but it's 07:53.290 --> 07:58.030 a big league advance. And the deal pretty much it's 07:58.030 --> 08:01.330 specifically geared towards baseball players. Walk us 08:01.330 --> 08:01.810 through that. 08:01.850 --> 08:04.100 Sean Murray: Sure. Yeah. So everyone, all of our viewers are 08:04.100 --> 08:07.100 more or less familiar with merchant cash advances. We've 08:07.100 --> 08:09.890 now learned about something else called a big league advance. 08:09.950 --> 08:13.280 It's very, very, very similar to a merchant cash advance, but 08:13.280 --> 08:16.610 it's directed at baseball players, as you mentioned, it's 08:16.610 --> 08:19.700 directed primarily at minor league players, is my 08:19.700 --> 08:23.060 understanding. And what they're offering is essentially capital 08:23.090 --> 08:25.400 upfront, because you're if you're a minor league player, 08:25.730 --> 08:27.860 you really don't make that much money. I've heard you can 08:27.860 --> 08:31.670 make like, you know, $1,000 a month or something. Right? 08:31.700 --> 08:33.980 It's you can't live off it. Yeah, you have to have another 08:33.980 --> 08:37.070 job. You know what I mean? If you don't have a big, you're not 08:37.070 --> 08:39.620 like a trust fund kid. Yeah, I don't know how many minor league 08:39.620 --> 08:43.910 players or bares.But what this company will do Big League 08:43.910 --> 08:46.820 Advance, and I didn't speak to them. So this isn't comments 08:46.820 --> 08:49.550 that were sent to me. It's based upon what I was able to read on 08:49.550 --> 08:53.000 their own website. But they will essentially give a minor league 08:53.000 --> 08:56.840 player a large sum of capital upfront, and in return, they 08:56.840 --> 09:00.080 sign away a percentage of whatever earnings, they'll get 09:00.080 --> 09:03.860 it, they end up signing an MLB contract. So if your minor league 09:03.860 --> 09:06.470 player you could get offered, I don't know, let's say half 09:06.470 --> 09:08.900 million dollars, maybe maybe, maybe less than that. Right? 09:08.900 --> 09:11.390 Yeah. And if you're not making very much half million dollars 09:11.390 --> 09:14.090 up front sounds pretty good. Yeah. So the trade off to that 09:14.090 --> 09:17.630 is, while if you end up becoming a major league player, a 09:17.630 --> 09:20.240 percentage of the contract that whatever you earn, whatever you 09:20.240 --> 09:22.460 signed for, will go to the company that gave you that 09:22.460 --> 09:26.420 money. If you never make the pros, you never get signed by a 09:26.420 --> 09:29.720 major league team, then you don't owe anything at all. So 09:29.720 --> 09:32.000 it's a pretty good trade off to be a minor league player to get 09:32.000 --> 09:36.440 this huge sum of money. Knowing that, hey, if you never go pro, 09:36.890 --> 09:39.080 you don't owe anything back. So imagine the amount was like 09:39.080 --> 09:39.800 500k? 09:39.860 --> 09:40.220 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. 09:41.360 --> 09:43.460 Sean Murray: And they're like, hey, if you become Pro, you 09:43.460 --> 09:46.100 know, then we're gonna need like, 8% of all your future MLB 09:46.100 --> 09:48.500 earnings. That might sound pretty good. 09:48.560 --> 09:52.430 But the reason you brought it up is because the biggest news 09:52.430 --> 09:54.920 right now is that we have a player for the Padres who signed 09:54.920 --> 09:57.410 a 14 year contract for $340 million 09:58.340 --> 10:02.180 Johny Fernandez: And their cut gets out, and if he, their cut is 10:02.180 --> 10:03.980 potentially going to be as much as 30 million. 10:04.140 --> 10:06.480 Sean Murray: Yeah. And so the way where that number comes from 10:06.480 --> 10:10.380 is that I think they take up 10 perce- this is all agreed upon 10:10.470 --> 10:12.870 at the time that they're doing the contract- they take up to 10:12.870 --> 10:19.710 10% of your future earnings, but the average they say is 8%. So I 10:19.710 --> 10:23.400 think the $30 million numbers roughly 8%, like $300 or 10:23.970 --> 10:27.150 $340 million. It could be less, it could even be a little bit 10:27.150 --> 10:30.120 more. But it's somewhere in that neighborhood of what he's going 10:30.120 --> 10:33.180 to have to give to Big League Advance. So, of course, it's in 10:33.180 --> 10:36.210 the news, because, you know, because everyone's wondering, is 10:36.210 --> 10:39.000 this deal worth it? This player signed this amazing contract, 10:39.000 --> 10:41.700 and from what I understand, it's kind of a landmark, a landmark 10:41.700 --> 10:45.450 deal. All of a sudden, over 14 years, he's got a fork over 30 10:45.720 --> 10:48.150 some million dollars over two Big League Advance and like, 10:48.150 --> 10:50.850 well, what did he get for it? My understanding was that he was 10:50.850 --> 10:53.190 pretty happy that some of these players are actually pretty 10:53.190 --> 10:56.250 happy with it. And I haven't heard any I haven't heard any 10:56.250 --> 10:59.280 regret stories. I did hear I did hear one, yeah, there was a 10:59.280 --> 11:01.590 there was a lawsuit or something filed, but he ended up 11:01.590 --> 11:06.090 apologizing to the company. So you know, it seems like this is 11:06.090 --> 11:09.930 a pretty good product that baseball players could benefit 11:09.930 --> 11:10.230 from. 11:10.260 --> 11:12.480 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, and it's interesting, because we - you've 11:12.480 --> 11:14.880 heard this and I've heard this that like a lot of baseball 11:14.880 --> 11:18.390 players, a lot of athletes, like once the money is gone. Like 11:18.390 --> 11:21.990 some of them just go completely broke. Yeah, and you know, but 11:22.200 --> 11:25.800 this is definitely an interesting way. You know, to I 11:25.800 --> 11:28.530 mean, if they make it, you know, they don't make it then, you 11:28.530 --> 11:28.800 know, 11:28.870 --> 11:30.220 Sean Murray: What's your favorite baseball team? 11:33.700 --> 11:36.820 I don't know. Cuz then we might have rivals here in the studio. 11:37.180 --> 11:37.780 What's yours? 11:37.840 --> 11:38.920 Yankees? Okay. 11:38.921 --> 11:42.830 Johny Fernandez: I go Yankees. I'm not a big Mets guy. Okay, I 11:42.830 --> 11:45.080 didn't grow up with the Mets, grew up towards the Yankees. But 11:45.080 --> 11:48.380 I know that's like, depending on who you're with, and it can 11:48.380 --> 11:50.090 divide a whole room. So. 11:50.740 --> 11:53.470 Sean Murray: That's true. I am not a Yankee fan to an extent 11:53.471 --> 11:56.290 that I hate other teams. 11:56.291 --> 11:56.510 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. 11:56.511 --> 11:57.958 Sean Murray: You know, I know. It's no, because it's like, the 11:57.988 --> 11:59.726 only thing I can say. Because, you know, we're gonna we're 12:01.850 --> 12:03.800 gonna offend part of the audience, I grew up in. I grew 12:03.800 --> 12:07.010 up in New York, you know what I mean? So, I'm a Yankees fan. But 12:07.010 --> 12:11.540 if somebody say a Red Sox fan or something, it doesn't mean like 12:11.540 --> 12:13.940 a somebody from the Boston area likes the Red Sox, 12:13.970 --> 12:16.040 Johny Fernandez: but even here locally, with the subway series 12:16.250 --> 12:17.930 you either choose the Yankees or the Mets. 12:18.260 --> 12:20.420 Sean Murray: But I don't hate Met fans, but I know that 12:20.420 --> 12:24.440 they're people that take it to the extreme. Canceled deBanked, 12:24.470 --> 12:39.770 Sean says he likes the Yankees, Red Sox rule. I'm in trouble. 12:39.770 --> 12:40.910 Yeah, I just got canceled. 12:45.770 --> 12:50.120 Johny Fernandez: Alright that's good. And so the next thing is 12:50.810 --> 12:56.000 in regards to the MCA, and prohibition in Maryland, so the 12:56.000 --> 12:59.990 new house bill passed. House Bill 664, so Sean, let's go 12:59.990 --> 13:02.180 ahead and jump in straight on that because that's something 13:02.180 --> 13:07.040 that it's seems very similar to something that passed here in 13:07.040 --> 13:07.730 New York. 13:08.320 --> 13:10.570 Sean Murray: Right? Yeah, it does. So what you're referring 13:10.570 --> 13:14.260 to is the bill in the Maryland State Legislature that was a 13:14.260 --> 13:17.380 state, statewide bill that stands to only affect the state 13:17.380 --> 13:21.730 of Maryland, not the rest of the country. Maryland interesting in 13:21.730 --> 13:25.660 that last year, it proposed members of the legislature, not 13:25.660 --> 13:30.970 the whole state, but members of the legislature proposed a a law 13:31.090 --> 13:35.560 that would ban outright ban, merchant cash advance products 13:35.590 --> 13:40.600 very, very strange and narrow bill, usually when you have a 13:40.600 --> 13:45.160 bill that's that's aimed at alternative finance, they kind 13:45.160 --> 13:48.850 of try to get everything at once. Small Business Loans 13:48.850 --> 13:52.630 factoring equipment leasing, MCA, right is because they're 13:52.630 --> 13:55.870 trying to standardize things or, you know, make things uniform, 13:56.200 --> 14:00.490 or enhanced disclosures. So it's very strange last year, to see a 14:00.490 --> 14:04.060 bill that would actually try to ban I mean, they call it the 14:04.060 --> 14:07.570 merchant cash advance prohibition bill. Very strange. 14:07.660 --> 14:10.600 I mean, like somebody in Maryland really hates the 14:10.600 --> 14:13.420 merchant cash advance. And so that bill ended up dying, 14:14.770 --> 14:18.160 potentially, because of COVID kind of took over the whole 14:18.160 --> 14:20.950 conversation. And the bill never made it out of committee. So 14:20.950 --> 14:25.960 never voted on in the floor. The bill is back, more or less, it's 14:25.960 --> 14:29.890 not called merchant cash advance prohibition. Now, it's got this 14:29.890 --> 14:34.120 whole other whole other name that purports to look like it's 14:34.120 --> 14:36.760 a disclosure bill, which is what happened in New York, they 14:36.760 --> 14:40.300 passed the disclosure bill that mandates that you have to 14:40.300 --> 14:43.630 disclose an APR, even if one can't be calculated. If you 14:43.630 --> 14:46.210 can't calculate one, you have to estimate one so it wasn't that 14:46.210 --> 14:48.580 weird to see that in this bill. You know, like, oh, let's look 14:48.580 --> 14:51.340 at New York to see what they what they're doing. But this one 14:51.340 --> 14:54.880 goes one step further. It says that, when you estimate your 14:54.880 --> 14:58.540 APR, that's all good and fine, but the max estimate can only be 14:58.540 --> 15:02.920 24%. If it's beyond 24%, it's illegal to the point where you 15:02.920 --> 15:05.290 could actually end up going going to jail if you do a 15:05.290 --> 15:07.210 transaction that that exceeds that number. 15:08.740 --> 15:12.640 Johny Fernandez: It's like half New York shut down MCA. 15:12.690 --> 15:15.750 Sean Murray: Well, yeah, you know, and I, you know, it's 15:15.750 --> 15:18.030 weird how they picked the 24% of the I don't know what that 15:18.030 --> 15:22.170 number is supposed to represent. Because the number that 15:22.170 --> 15:25.320 represents the threshold for fairness that I've come across 15:25.320 --> 15:29.310 most often seems to be 36%. I don't know how that number came 15:29.310 --> 15:31.350 about. Yeah. But when you hear about regulating, when you hear 15:31.350 --> 15:35.130 about interest rate caps, you usually hear about 36% APR and 15:35.130 --> 15:38.190 never heard one that said, 24%. Now we do have something in New 15:38.190 --> 15:44.730 York that says you can't lend above 16% APR. Or you need some 15:44.730 --> 15:48.000 sort of, you know, license or something like that. But I've 15:48.000 --> 15:50.220 never heard of that. The Maryland thing is very strange. 15:50.280 --> 15:54.930 And also, it only attempts to do this for merchant cash advance. 15:55.140 --> 15:59.070 This isn't a business loan, disclosure bill. Yeah, it's not 15:59.070 --> 16:03.390 a broker, you know, like licensing, but well, it is like 16:03.420 --> 16:06.360 it requires licensing and all this other stuff. But it what it 16:06.360 --> 16:09.360 really effectively tries to do is prohibit merchant cash 16:09.360 --> 16:12.570 advances from being transacted in the state. I don't really 16:12.570 --> 16:16.170 know why. There was a hearing that took place, it was a live 16:16.170 --> 16:20.910 public hearing copy of it is up on our website. And we got to 16:20.910 --> 16:24.240 hear a little bit of a discussion on this bill. And 16:24.240 --> 16:26.160 there were members from representatives from the 16:26.160 --> 16:30.090 industry in the MCA industry, as well as some members of the 16:30.090 --> 16:33.270 state's legislature also talking, and then we'll get to 16:33.270 --> 16:37.680 kind of say what their piece was. And I don't really feel 16:37.680 --> 16:41.760 like there were any arguments put forward for the member who 16:41.760 --> 16:45.300 proposed the law, it seemed to me that I want to 16:45.300 --> 16:48.210 mischaracterize you. And I mean, I was just an observer of it. 16:48.210 --> 16:53.640 But it seemed to me like he was seeking the information, kind of 16:53.640 --> 16:57.780 like, let's kind of propose a band first, and then let me find 16:57.780 --> 17:01.500 out what this even is. Yeah. And I mean, like he was he was 17:01.500 --> 17:04.170 asking, like fundamental questions like, how do these 17:04.170 --> 17:06.840 work? Yeah. Very weird question to be asking when you're 17:06.840 --> 17:10.410 proposing a ban. Yeah. Right. Like, he's probably Yeah, but 17:10.410 --> 17:12.720 you know what I mean, like, I know, yeah, you should know, you 17:12.720 --> 17:15.270 should probably know it inside and out. Yeah. By the time 17:15.270 --> 17:17.400 you're already you should be like, I know everything there is 17:17.400 --> 17:20.820 to know. Now we need to ban it. Right. It's weird to say, let's 17:20.820 --> 17:23.850 ban it. How did this work? Yeah, it seemed that was the that was 17:23.851 --> 17:24.870 my personal take away. 17:24.809 --> 17:27.269 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. So let me ask you this, Sean. Do you think 17:27.269 --> 17:29.729 that obviously, we've seen New York do something very similar 17:29.729 --> 17:32.279 to this Wi Fi? we're now seeing Maryland do something similar 17:32.279 --> 17:34.739 o this? What about other state ? Do you think this will be 17:34.739 --> 17:37.379 a pattern with other states that they will also start 17:37.529 --> 17:41.249 implementing something like this? But then we can also see 17:41.249 --> 17:46.079 that some other states will maybe welcome MCA is, you know, 17:46.109 --> 17:49.019 the MCA Business. So what a e your thoughts? Do you think this 17:49.019 --> 17:51.719 will continue to be a trend across? You know, the Northeast? 17:52.589 --> 17:57.299 Out West? 17:53.750 --> 17:57.140 Sean Murray: Yeah, well, these type of proposals, they don't 17:57.140 --> 18:02.390 come from nowhere. They usually come from an advocacy group who, 18:03.260 --> 18:08.420 you know, embarks on a long mission to complete some type of 18:08.450 --> 18:12.950 objective. The fact that this bill ended up in Maryland, 18:13.310 --> 18:15.740 wasn't just because people in Maryland were sitting there 18:15.890 --> 18:19.910 being like, oh, you know, we've read in the news in New York, we 18:19.910 --> 18:23.540 want to do it too, right? Somebody proposed it to them, 18:23.900 --> 18:26.270 and show them what was done in New York and show them what was 18:26.270 --> 18:29.690 done in California and saying, you too, should also adopt it. 18:29.990 --> 18:34.130 And here's how they did it. Right. So which whoever the 18:34.130 --> 18:38.720 group is behind all this, right? It's my belief that they will 18:38.720 --> 18:43.940 continue to push for these type of changes in other states. Now, 18:43.940 --> 18:47.540 whether or not the states will be as open to it as California 18:47.630 --> 18:51.350 and New York, which are very progressive, is yet to be seen. 18:51.800 --> 18:56.180 I highly doubt we'll end up in a situation where all 50 would do 18:56.180 --> 19:00.110 it. Yeah. Especially since we're dealing with commercial 19:00.110 --> 19:03.380 transactions. That's the craziest part about all this is 19:03.380 --> 19:06.470 that these aren't really consumer protections, right? 19:06.500 --> 19:12.140 these are, these are commercial financing regulations. And I 19:12.140 --> 19:15.890 would be shocked if this was, you know, widely adopted, like 19:15.890 --> 19:20.300 try attempts to ban or whatever whatever it is, in even even 19:20.330 --> 19:24.470 having a mandatory APR disclosure. And I don't really 19:24.470 --> 19:29.570 know ultimately, what you know what that will accomplish? 19:29.630 --> 19:36.110 Right? From what I've heard that disclosing an APR on a loan, you 19:36.110 --> 19:43.730 know, forget about MCAs for a second doesn't necessarily allow 19:43.850 --> 19:48.500 doesn't really make people change their minds. Yeah. Right. 19:48.500 --> 19:52.490 And so they might be informed about the number. But if you're 19:52.520 --> 19:55.940 still doing the same thing after that, you know, it's kind of 19:55.940 --> 19:57.140 like well, what really happened? 19:57.170 --> 19:57.410 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, 19:57.650 --> 19:57.980 Sean Murray: Right 19:57.990 --> 20:02.490 Johny Fernandez: Yeah. Yeah. That's very much true. So that's 20:02.490 --> 20:03.210 interesting. 20:03.690 --> 20:06.120 Sean Murray: You were asking like when the states become 20:06.120 --> 20:10.980 friendly, or something like that? Well, you know, the states 20:10.980 --> 20:15.090 like Florida, which is technically been a debtor 20:15.330 --> 20:18.510 friendly state more than a creditor friendly state, that is 20:18.510 --> 20:19.800 where you just were just in Florida. 20:19.800 --> 20:22.380 Johny Fernandez: Yeah I was in Florida. It is something I spoke 20:22.380 --> 20:25.170 with the mayor about. So that question was asked. 20:25.380 --> 20:28.080 Sean Murray: Yeah, so they're, they're not normally known as a 20:28.080 --> 20:33.270 creditor friendly state. But they are from what I'm get parts 20:33.270 --> 20:39.180 of it are FinTech open minded. Yeah. All right. And I think 20:39.210 --> 20:44.850 that involves all types of financial innovation. And so 20:45.780 --> 20:48.330 what I'm what I'm hearing is that there is an interest level 20:48.330 --> 20:52.410 in relocating from states, like New York, to states like Florida 20:52.440 --> 20:55.590 in order to continuing to conduct your business. 20:56.110 --> 20:57.880 Johny Fernandez: That's interesting. Do you think that 20:58.330 --> 21:02.320 these type of decisions that are being made will start driving 21:02.770 --> 21:06.550 will pretty much be the reason why MCA is dead in New York or 21:06.550 --> 21:07.720 in Maryland? 21:08.470 --> 21:09.970 Sean Murray: These type of decisions? What do you mean? 21:10.110 --> 21:12.630 Johny Fernandez: Like these type of bills that are being 21:12.630 --> 21:17.250 proposed, the fact that they're being brought to light and that, 21:17.280 --> 21:20.940 you know, there's people like the advocacy groups or like 21:20.940 --> 21:27.270 leaders that want to pretty much push MCA, MCA owners out? Will 21:27.300 --> 21:29.190 like, kill the business here in New York? 21:30.000 --> 21:31.770 Sean Murray: Well, that's a, that's a really good question. 21:32.130 --> 21:37.620 And that is to be seen. My understanding is that the New 21:37.620 --> 21:40.950 York disclosure bill goes into effect at the end of June, there 21:40.950 --> 21:47.970 was originally speculation that it was going to be delayed until 21:48.000 --> 21:52.170 about January, January 2022. And now it looks like the original 21:52.170 --> 21:56.190 date is, you know, set in stone, and we're looking at June, for 21:56.190 --> 21:59.700 one is going to be implemented. What's strange about the law is 21:59.700 --> 22:02.850 that it talks about transacting business in New York, it doesn't 22:02.850 --> 22:05.220 necessarily, and I'm not a lawyer, maybe, you know, maybe 22:05.220 --> 22:07.770 the lawyers gonna get mad at me for talking about it. But, you 22:07.770 --> 22:10.080 know, this is my layman's person of it. It talks about 22:10.080 --> 22:14.460 transacting business in the state of New York. It makes me 22:14.460 --> 22:17.460 wonder if if I was in New York, and I decided not to work with 22:17.460 --> 22:19.920 New York customers in this transaction still happening 22:19.920 --> 22:23.370 here. You know what I mean? So and so maybe it's safer, to, to 22:23.370 --> 22:25.950 not operate in the state out of an abundance of caution, 22:25.960 --> 22:29.200 Johny Fernandez: but was unclear and this is something that, 22:29.470 --> 22:33.130 again, we're not lawyers, so we definitely need to specify with, 22:33.160 --> 22:37.480 you know, someone from the office or a lawyer, but when I 22:37.480 --> 22:40.900 met when I met transaction doing a transaction in New York wasn't 22:40.900 --> 22:44.320 the big debate that we discussed, was if it touches New 22:44.320 --> 22:47.170 York, like technically like, alright, like doing a 22:47.170 --> 22:50.290 transaction? Is it working one on one with someone? Or if 22:50.650 --> 22:54.100 there's some type of connection to New York? Does that count as 22:55.240 --> 22:57.970 doing as you know, transacting in New York? 22:58.170 --> 23:00.840 Sean Murray: Well, these are the things that certain litigators 23:00.840 --> 23:03.360 I'm sure are licking their, you know, licking their fingers and 23:03.360 --> 23:08.610 lips for you know, getting ready to argue, yeah. I think it it's 23:08.610 --> 23:11.160 important, though, that we talk about it. And we mentioned it, 23:11.160 --> 23:14.730 even if lawyers like, you know, like, you know, because if 23:14.730 --> 23:18.840 you're continuing to conduct business in New York, and you're 23:18.840 --> 23:23.160 not fully versed, or fully briefed by your own legal 23:23.160 --> 23:27.060 counsel on how to proceed with this new law in place, you could 23:27.060 --> 23:29.670 run into trouble, right? People are like, oh, it's some 23:29.670 --> 23:32.430 disclosures. Right. So you gotta add a box, you got to add, put a 23:32.430 --> 23:36.330 number and then just disclose, disclose. It's a little bit more 23:36.330 --> 23:40.380 than that. Yeah. It's, uh, and I think people should at least 23:40.380 --> 23:43.860 take away from this conversation that I better have a lawyer. 23:43.890 --> 23:47.610 Yeah, read this and tell me if I should still be doing business 23:47.820 --> 23:50.280 in any way. In the state of New York. Yeah. 23:51.000 --> 23:53.820 Johny Fernandez: And I think we were also when we talked about 23:53.820 --> 23:57.180 and we've the stories on it, the fact that there's so much open 23:57.180 --> 24:02.250 ended questions in that, you know, just that entire thing. 24:02.640 --> 24:06.810 Because there's questions that are left unanswered, and they 24:06.810 --> 24:10.740 just kind of draft it together, it changed. And they kind of 24:10.740 --> 24:15.450 just kept it hush hush, and, you know, kept pretty much everyone 24:15.510 --> 24:17.850 up in the air, because there's a lot of questions that no one has 24:17.850 --> 24:18.450 the answers to. 24:18.510 --> 24:20.460 Sean Murray: That's right. We didn't like we were just saying, 24:20.520 --> 24:23.310 we still only have the answers. It's like, Yeah, all we can tell 24:23.310 --> 24:26.820 you to do is you should probably go yeah, contact a lawyer and 24:26.820 --> 24:29.460 tell tell you what to do. That's the best thing to do. You know, 24:29.460 --> 24:32.280 as a layman, I can form my own kind of opinions about what it 24:32.280 --> 24:34.620 means. But yeah, there's a lot of things in there. I don't even 24:34.650 --> 24:37.740 I have no clue. I don't really don't know what it means. And, 24:37.740 --> 24:40.320 uh, you know, but I'm not a funding company. We're not we're 24:40.320 --> 24:42.870 not funders. But if you are out there, if you're a broker, and 24:42.870 --> 24:46.080 if you're a funder, if you're a lead generator, you really need 24:46.080 --> 24:49.980 to work with counsel about compliance with this law. What 24:49.980 --> 24:51.930 is it you need to do, maybe everything is going to be fine, 24:52.110 --> 24:54.480 but you need someone to tell you it's going to going to be okay, 24:54.510 --> 24:55.770 or what you should be doing. 24:57.370 --> 25:00.760 Johny Fernandez: Awesome, great advice. So i think that wraps it 25:00.760 --> 25:04.660 up for us now. Big Day today's Bachelor Monday. 25:05.110 --> 25:06.220 Sean Murray: Bachelor Monday. 25:06.280 --> 25:07.870 Johny Fernandez: Yeah, we're excited for that. I know 25:07.870 --> 25:10.960 everyone's been talking about that little snippet from a 25:10.960 --> 25:14.440 couple weeks ago. So I'm excited to see what happens tonight. 25:14.680 --> 25:15.940 Sean Murray: Is it hometown's finally? 25:16.060 --> 25:18.280 Johny Fernandez: Not yet, we're getting. We're getting there. 25:19.900 --> 25:21.730 Sean Murray: Next, the next bachelor brief will be after 25:22.330 --> 25:22.750 hometown 25:23.080 --> 25:25.570 Johny Fernandez: No, it is. Oh, it is hometown. I'm sorry. Yes. 25:25.570 --> 25:25.960 Okay. 25:26.000 --> 25:27.950 Sean Murray: Yeah, it's all coming up next. 25:29.450 --> 25:31.640 Johny Fernandez: It is. I'm tired. I forgot about that. It 25:31.640 --> 25:32.120 was it was 25:32.240 --> 25:34.700 Sean Murray: I need to get my bachelor bracket. I actually got 25:34.700 --> 25:37.610 a text right before we went live that I have reminders set my 25:37.610 --> 25:38.390 bachelor bracket. 25:38.420 --> 25:40.100 Johny Fernandez: That's awesome. Well, you have a couple more 25:40.100 --> 25:41.210 hours before the show, sir. 25:41.240 --> 25:42.410 Sean Murray: Yeah, but I don't want to wait till the last 25:42.410 --> 25:44.480 minute. And everyone's trying to set their lineup you know, right 25:44.480 --> 25:48.980 before. This is the fantasy sports that I do. 25:51.680 --> 25:54.110 Johny Fernandez: Well, we'll see you guys next time. I can't wait 25:54.110 --> 25:57.950 to chat with you guys again. And if anyone has any comments, 25:57.950 --> 26:00.920 questions, possible, write to us reach out to us 26:00.950 --> 26:05.480 Sean Murray: Email, email, LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, 26:06.020 --> 26:06.920 comment away, 26:06.950 --> 26:07.490 Johny Fernandez: Twitter, 26:07.700 --> 26:08.780 Sean Murray: Twitter, whatever you want, 26:08.760 --> 26:10.995 Johny Fernandez: Whatever you want. Definitely let us know. 26:11.048 --> 26:14.295 engage with us because we're always looking for feedback. And 26:14.349 --> 26:17.809 if anyone has any questions, any tips definitely reach out to us. 26:17.862 --> 26:20.790 So awesome. Again, Johny Fernandez, here with deBanked. 26:20.780 --> 26:22.020 Sean Murray: Sean Murray with deBanked 26:22.010 --> 26:23.120 Johny Fernandez: See you guys next time.